Author Topic: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?  (Read 1907 times)

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Offline josordoni

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Now with no offence to anyone who likes Chinese millefiori bottles, I can't help thinking this is the bottom of the pile when it comes to quality....

The glass is very oily and yellow, am I right a) that it is chinese, b) that it might have a bit of age to it?

http://clarkagency.co.uk/clicpicapril/chinese_bottle/_local_chinese_bottle.htm

My own gallery for the mo, I'll pop it into my Glass Gallery if it is viewed to be worth keeping for posterity (most certainly not prosperity....  ;D ;D)



Offline Wuff

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2007, 06:30:42 PM »
I've got an almost identical one: 95 mm dia, 109 mm high (main body), 1165 g (all together).
The glass of mine seems to be much clearer, though there is some yellow tint in the thick bottom part.
Not high quality - but I quite liked it - wouldn't have bought it otherwise ;-).
From the canes I always assumed it was Murano, second half 20th century - but that's just a vague guess: I also would be very interested to hear other's opinion on it's maker.
Wolf Seelentag, St.Gallen
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Offline Leni

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2007, 08:08:11 PM »
These canes are similar to some seen in Murano weights, but even the Murano-made canes are available for sale on the internet, so the weights and bottles could be made anywhere!   I reckon it's a Chinese one.  Chinese glass is of very variable quality, in my experience. 
Leni


Offline Wuff

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2007, 09:17:56 PM »
If sold via Internet, this would mean fairly recent. I would assume that Murano canes were likely exported before the Internet: does anyone have info on earlier weights manufactured outside Murano (or Italy) but using canes bought from Murano manufacturers?
Wolf Seelentag, St.Gallen
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Offline KevinH

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2007, 08:45:22 PM »
Yes - Chinese. I also have one just like it, except it has no "dipper" (as is the case with some others I have seen). Canes match others in known Chinese weights - and they also appear in some items shown in my Zibo trade catalogues from 2000. Base also shows the yellow very well, and is rough ground, too.

I think the date of these is probably "last ten years or so".

Mine was bought at an "antiques & collectables" fair in the UK - and it had an "old English" hoped-for attribution. I knew it was not OE, but it wasn't until later that I discovered it to be Chinese. The "dipper" is typical and still appears in the same shape in some of the current bottles. I paid a bit too much for my example!
KevinH


Offline glasstrufflehunter

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2007, 06:37:41 PM »
The white 'coggy' looking canes do look a lot like italian canes. I wou;d need a closer look to say for sure but the red and blue canes are typical recent Chinese. It is interesting that it is so yellow because I've seen some recent Chinese stuff that is very clear.
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Offline Wuff

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2007, 06:56:01 PM »
The canes are very difficult to photograph due to the shape of the bottle - the only clear pictures can be taken through the bottle neck:
(http://www.seelentags.de/pw/sonst80e200.jpg)
There are no just white canes in my sample - only the two shown on the image.
Wolf Seelentag, St.Gallen
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Offline Leni

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2007, 06:58:43 PM »
IMO the latest Chinese glass is definitely of a higher quality than that of only comparatively few years ago.  I am not sure of the chemical constituents, but as I mentioned in my thread in the Glass forum about 'Oily Glass', it was mostly my Chinese weights which were affected.  However, the oldest weights (1930's - 60's) seemed to be less affected, although the colour of the glass was in some cases quite yellow. 

It would be very interesting to know if particular Chinese glass houses produce clearer glass, and exactly what the chemical composition is.  However, my recent attempts to find out anything from China about their glass making has so far met with no success  :-\ 
Leni


Offline josordoni

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2007, 07:52:15 PM »
IMO the latest Chinese glass is definitely of a higher quality than that of only comparatively few years ago.  I am not sure of the chemical constituents, but as I mentioned in my thread in the Glass forum about 'Oily Glass', it was mostly my Chinese weights which were affected.  However, the oldest weights (1930's - 60's) seemed to be less affected, although the colour of the glass was in some cases quite yellow. 

It would be very interesting to know if particular Chinese glass houses produce clearer glass, and exactly what the chemical composition is.  However, my recent attempts to find out anything from China about their glass making has so far met with no success  :-\ 

Certainly my later Chinese lampworked weights are much much cleaner and brighter glass.  Which is why I presumed this had a bit of age to it, as I would have expected the sophistication of the later works to be trying to emulate the Scottish bottles rather than Old English. 

Kev, like you I paid over the odds for this one....I didn't look carefully enough at it before bidding.  :'(



Offline glasstrufflehunter

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Re: Chinese millefiori bottle - very yellow, would it be an old one?
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2007, 08:52:58 PM »
Wuff: Those are definitely Chinese canes. They have some similarity to a Fratelli Toso cane but they are typical Chinese colors :orangey red, weak cobalt blue and milky white (as opposed to the more opaque white I usually see in Italian glass). That six petaled flower in the center of each cane is characteristic of Chinese weights.
I collect Scottish and Italian paperweights and anything else that strikes my fancy.

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