Author Topic: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot  (Read 899 times)

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Offline BJB

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Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« on: April 22, 2007, 11:43:32 AM »
Hi,

I saw this a couple of weeks ago  at a car boot, loked it and forgot to go back and get it, then when looking for something else spotted it in my Walsh book  :'(

Anyway went back to the same bootsale today and there it was so I ran to the stall and picked it up, left OH standing  ;D

It is the most beautiful pale lavender colour with iridised knob and body.

http://i15.tinypic.com/2e3de75.jpg

There is one on the Great Glass site photo gallery under John Walsh, top line last photo. It is isn't it despite my usual wonderful  :P photography ??

Barbara


Offline Leni

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2007, 11:57:27 AM »
I reckon so, Barbara!  Nice one! :D
Leni


Offline BJB

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2007, 12:04:27 PM »
Leni,

I couldn't belive it when I got home two weeks ago and found the picture in the book, I was so disapointed, and cross at myself for not going back.

When I spotted it today, I was sure I wasn't going home without it. I must have beat the 4 minute mile record  ::)

Barbara


Offline Bernard C

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2007, 01:27:38 AM »
Quote from: BJB
... It is the most beautiful pale lavender colour with iridised knob and body. ...

Barbara — Iridised?   Your excellent photograph shows beautiful opalescence:  I can't see any iridescence, but that could be a trick of the camera.

Your lidded pot is Walsh Vesta Venetian.   Reynolds tells us that it was launched in the Pottery Gazette on November 1, 1907;  trade mark applied for October 16 1907, and granted March 4, 1908.   Initially the style was made in Walsh iridised mother-of-pearl glass;  in between the wars Walsh opalescent glass seems to have dominated Vesta Venetian production.

I would be interested in rib counts, both the intial ribbing which was twisted to produce the spiral "threads", and the second ribbing.   Your main pot is probably 18/18, but the lid could be 18/18 or 16/16.    I've had one through my hands where the lid was 12/12, but I think that's quite unusual, and suggests two glassmakers at work on Vesta Venetian at the same time.

What were these lidded pots for?   Bath salts?

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline BJB

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2007, 08:30:23 AM »
Hi Bernard,

It is opalescence, I knew what I meant  ::)

Have counted the ribs and both are 18/18, the ribs are easy its the spirals that send you boss eyed.

They may have been used for bath salts, or just as a pot to match the vases?

I like it but its a bit too flowery for my taste.

Barbara


Offline Bernard C

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2007, 11:15:33 AM »
Barbara — Thanks for the rib counts.   One day I might be able to tell you exactly how many rib dip moulds Walsh had of each rib count.   Not that anyone except Eric and me will be in the slightest degree interested.

I quite like bath salts as the function of these pots.   Today, with bath foam, and baths often replaced by showers, we tend to forget the need then (and now) to soften bath water before using soap.

Please would American readers note that their collector terminology for air-trap — "Mother-of-Pearl", often abbreviated to "MOP" — is not the usage of the term in my earlier reply.   Walsh mother-of-pearl is a tiny initial gather of hard white opal, possibly lightshade glass, cased with one or more layers of transparent or opalescent glass, and usually iridised.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline Bernard C

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2007, 10:01:48 AM »
Quote from: Bernard C
... I would be interested in rib counts, both the intial ribbing which was twisted to produce the spiral "threads", and the second ribbing.   Your main pot is probably 18/18, but the lid could be 18/18 or 16/16.    I've had one through my hands where the lid was 12/12, but I think that's quite unusual, and suggests two glassmakers at work on Vesta Venetian at the same time. ...

I've just realised that the above is only part of the story, so could be misleading.   It works fine for single pieces of Vesta Venetian like your pot and its lid, but it's more complex with double pieces, typically a Vesta Venetian vase joined to a Vesta Venetian foot.   Here the two components, the vase and the foot, would have been made simultaneously, timed so that they were ready for joining at the same moment.   You see the problem.   We have two master glassmakers at two different chairs some distance apart.   With the speed at which they are working they can't share dip moulds.   Now I am certain that Walsh had only the one 18-rib dip mould, which was used almost exclusively for Vesta Venetian.   So the foot maker had to use another mould, usually a 16-rib dip mould.   So the example shown in Gulliver p.146 and Reynolds p.44 (same vase, I am sure) is almost certainly 18/18 on a 16/16 foot.

You would think this difference in rib counts strange if you didn't know the reason.   And, knowing the reason, you would think it strange if the vase and foot had the same rib counts!

Watching the glassmakers at work and their timing glued me to the viewing window at Formia on Murano.   It was like watching a beautifully choreographed ballet.  Components like feet and stems were delivered at exactly the right moment, and at the right temperature, without any rush or panic.   Fabulous.    I could have watched it all day.

Bernard C.  8)

Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline Lustrousstone

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Re: Is this a John Walsh Vesta Venetian Lidded Pot
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2009, 06:36:40 AM »
Barbara, can you add the photos back in to this thread please


 

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