Author Topic: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing  (Read 900 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Anne E.B.

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 1552
    • U.K.
Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« on: October 15, 2007, 02:34:20 PM »
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/hatpintray003.jpg
Larger view.

http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-8565
Smaller gallery view.

Presumably this is a hatpin dish or tray, as it came with some pretty lethal looking rusty hatpins.  It has a diamond registration lozenge as follows: Top fig. 24:  Centre right: the letter L.  Bottom: the letter H.  Centre left: fig. 2.  Looking on 1st.glassman's excellent lozenge translator, this glass design parcel number 2 was registered on 24th April 1882 by John Short Downing, Birmingham.  I've never heard of them and cannot find anything about them at all.  Does anyone know anything about them?  And, can anyone confirm that it is in fact a hatpin tray.  (Bernard, if you are lookiing in).

TIA
Anne
Anne E.B


Offline Lustrousstone

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 10843
  • Gender: Female
    • Warrington, UK
    • My Gallery
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2007, 06:49:26 PM »
I think it might be a pen tray because of the little rests rather than a hat pin tray. You wouldn't want ink from the nib getting on your handle


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3158
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2007, 04:36:05 AM »
Anne — as Christine said, it's a pen tray.   Thompson gives Downing's address as Crown Works, Commercial Street, Birmingham.   From memory, Commercial Wharf opened at the beginning of the century, so, by the middle of the century, there was a mix of heavy and light industry well established in the Commercial Street area.   So Crown Works could have been a glass works, but, if so, it was one of the last in central Birmingham.    I think it more likely that your pen tray was made in the Tyneside, Wearside, or Manchester glassworks.

Anyway, it's not too difficult to check in the Birmingham directories of the time.   If you do, remember to treat directory entries with some scepticism — what you are looking for are new and changed entries, which can be regarded as reasonably reliable.   As today, it was much less expensive for a directory publisher to buy all his competitors' directories and place a few advertisements in local newspapers requesting information, than to employ people to do the legwork around the streets, knocking on doors.   You can sometimes find some wonderfully out-of-date entries!

One classic example is Hobson's Fox-hunting Atlas, which dominated this specialist field for over half a century.   The first edition was an almost word for word transcription of an earlier directory onto C & J Walker's county maps, and quite legal, as the directory publisher had not thought it necessary to copyright his publication.   It took Hobson about a decade to get his information reasonably up-to-date, and his meets in the correct place on the maps — the whole exercise apparently without the necessity to have ever set foot outside his premises!

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3158
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2007, 05:47:44 AM »
Anne — Would it be possible to see a close-up of the registration lozenge?

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline Anne E.B.

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 1552
    • U.K.
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2007, 02:26:42 PM »
Thanks everyone for your help ;D

A pen tray it is then :).  It has four rests, so presumably would hold four pens, and I'm guessing they'd be wooden ones with nibs.  

Bernard - it was really difficult to get a good pic. of the registration lozenge but it seemed to work best when dusted with talc.powder.  I'm afraid this is the best image I could get:-
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/lozenge021.jpg
You can just make out the letter H at the bottom.

Anne E.B


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3158
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2007, 04:05:37 PM »
Anne — that lozenge, with the curly "d", the top-heavy "R" and the short "=" is familiar, but I can't think who at the moment.   It makes me more certain that it was made in one of the main pressed glass factories.

I would be grateful if you would retain both photographs for future reference.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline Anne E.B.

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 1552
    • U.K.
Anne E.B


Offline Adam

  • Glass Professional
  • Members
  • ***
  • Posts: 355
  • Sowerby 1949-56, Davidson 1956-61, Jobling 1961-72
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2007, 08:08:55 PM »
It looks very similar to one of Sowerby's, and yes to pen tray.

Adam D.



Offline johnphilip

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 2534
  • Gender: Male
  • JP
    • England
    • eBay ID
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2007, 09:04:51 PM »
just been up in the loft again as i have one similar,  sorry i keep doing this but i have had an ocd for the last thirty years, it is glass, mine  looks the same but the ends are straight not round and it has no reg mark.size is L 23cm W 6cm D 3cm.


Offline hegs

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 2
Re: Hatpin tray(?) Reg. by John Short Downing
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2007, 10:28:04 PM »
hi anne - re the backstamp on your item......if you type in 'glass back stamps' into your internet browser you will get pages of backstamps downloaded!

 

This Website is provided by Angela Bowey, PO Box 113, Paihia 0247, New Zealand