Author Topic: Unusual blue crown dish with a very strange reg diamond  (Read 1553 times)

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Offline mrvaselineglass

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Re: Unusual blue crown dish with a very strange reg diamond
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2008, 11:01:58 PM »
Last April (2007), I came across this listing at the KEW in their public search area (but can't find it now).  I did a 'image capture, and have the illustration on my computer.  there were notes under the item: "This design was also registered in Class I - Metal, Class III - Glass, as well as  in this class, Class IV - Earthenwares.  This means that the same design could be used for a variety of objects of the same form, but made from different materials.  Multiple class registration is often used by manufacturers of cosmetic/perfume containers."

This piece was registered as a "class 4, ornamental design for a jar."

I have seen the vaseline glass version that had the diamond lozenge marking on the inside of the dish.  Now, here is the kicker:  I have seen (have the photo SOMEPLACE in my computer!) of an opaque blue version, with a raised marking on the inside of the base, and it said BACCARAT.   So, It looks like the person who registered the design also used it with at least one other manufacturer.  It is not known who pressed the vaseline glass version for ALFRED EDMUND EDWARDES, Alver Cottage, Twickenham Green, Middlesex.  The Catalog ref. for the Image details are: BT 43/68.  The Registration details for No. 183953 is catalog ref. no. BT 44/8.  OH, the official listing at the KEW, shows the last name as EDWARDES with the extra 'E'. 

Hope this helps!
Dave Peterson
aka: Mr. Vaseline Glass


Offline Ivo

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lozenge question
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2010, 09:59:05 AM »
This rather spectacular inkwell (with a bit of damage on the inside) has a large, prominent Rd. lozenge on the bottom and the date translates to January 14, 1865. However, the class is I not III and so the lozenge finder comes up with no registration for parcel 8 on that date.

So it was not registered as a glass design - is it possible to figure out who made it?

Ivo
► BLUE HENRY ◄
 New Book: The Almost Forgotten Story of the Blue Glass Sputum Flask

all texts and pictures (c) Ivo Haanstra.


Offline Anne

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Re: lozenge question
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2010, 10:40:07 AM »
Ivo, I think your 14 January 1865 should be 14 February 1865 which states class III, also classes I & IV, with a parcel number of 8.

It's given as design 183953, proprietor Alfred Edmund Edwardes, Alver Cottage, Twickenham Green, Middlesex. Sadly no clue as to what the design relates to though. The reference is page 101 of Jenny Thompson's The Identification of English Pressed Glass.

We've discussed this previously here: http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,21696.0.html (the Alver Cottage rang a dim bell in my memory!!!)


Offline Ivo

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Re: lozenge question
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2010, 11:35:30 AM »
Okay - perfect answer. :hiclp:

There you go:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/designregisters/propitemdetail.asp?item_id=183953&proprietor=14&page=1

We have a name, a date and the hunch that Baccarat may have been involved in the production - which does not surprise me seeing the outrageous colour, quality and finish.

If you wish to merge these threads, go ahead.

Ivo
► BLUE HENRY ◄
 New Book: The Almost Forgotten Story of the Blue Glass Sputum Flask

all texts and pictures (c) Ivo Haanstra.


Offline UKGLASS

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Re: lozenge question
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2010, 05:40:34 PM »
Hi there
I had this piece about 15 years ago and found the same problem, you are correct that the class is not glass. It is in fact metal.  I had the opportunity to discuss it with Raymond Slack and the concensus of opinion was that it was originally produced in metal as an inkwell & registered as such, for whatever reason a glass manufacturer was then able to reproduce it in glass, alliances between glass and metal manufacturers was of course quite common. Only problem is Im damned if I can remember who the original metal maker was.
UKGLASS
Having read Ivos post i think its fair to say we now know who the metal maker was, certainley never heard of Alfred Edmund Edwardes as a glass maker, still no closer to who produced the glass unfortunately.


Offline KevinH

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Re: lozenge question
« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2010, 10:18:51 PM »
And here's another one shown in one of my non-paperweight web pages.

I thought I had commented about mine in connection with Barbara's (as shown in the GMB link Anne gave above), but clearly not - might have missed it. Having checked mine again, I can see that I misread the date letter in the lozenge as a "C" instead of "G".

I see that Barbara's (same colour as mine) has a large chip on the top which might suggest the loss of the Cross as shown in the National Archives information for design 183953 (as per Ivo's link). I can confirm that my example has a simple point at the domed finial which is part of the mouled shape - much the same as Ivo's. Perhaps the glass versions were not produced with a Cross on top?

Another of these (in opaque pale opalescent green , I think) was shown a few years ago in a Glass Circle / Association exhibition, "From Palace to Parlour", Aug - Oct 2003, at The Wallace Collection, Manchester Square, London. But no maker was stated.

Edited as indicated in bold or strikethroughs.
KevinH


Offline Anne

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Re: Unusual blue crown dish with a very strange reg diamond
« Reply #16 on: March 08, 2010, 11:48:01 PM »
Both topics merged for the sake of completeness.


 

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