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Author Topic: English Tazzas: one uranium/one amethyst  (Read 852 times)

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Offline mrvaselineglass

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English Tazzas: one uranium/one amethyst
« on: June 25, 2008, 10:15:12 PM »
I believe these to be made by John Walsh Walsh (3rd link below).  Cyril Manley ("Decorative Victorian Glass") lists Thomas Webb as the maker (photo #209).  However, here is my reasoning on John Walsh Walsh.  John Walsh Walsh made the Opaline Brocade pattern in vaseline opalescent, prior to Northwood making it in the USA.  Mike Weedon has a couple of examples on his website:
This first one has an exact match to the foot of my two tazza dishes.

This second one has a twist in the stem, just like my Tazzas, and the twist is in the same direction.

In addition, Hajdamach's book, "BRITISH GLASS 1800-1914", shows an original photo ad for John Walsh Walsh's pattern of Opaline Brocade, pg. 319, and there is one of the examples with the twist in the stem.

Anyway, I just got this amethyst and clear version today in the mail, to match my vaseline opalescent version.

I also have this Opaline Brocade in my collection, which also has the same twist, going the same direction.  Webb was not known for making Opaline Brocade, however.

Is my logic flawed?  The only reference I can find in a text for the vaseline opalescent tazza is Manley, but there are other mistakes in his text and he was also 'sure' of those pieces in regards to the maker. 

p.s. not that it matters in the hypothesis listed above, but the amethyst foot on my tazza has a dull green glow when exposed to a blacklight.  not what I would call uranium, but a definite reaction. 
Dave Peterson
aka: Mr. Vaseline Glass

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Offline Leni

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Re: English Tazzas: one uranium/one amethyst
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2008, 08:13:44 AM »
Congratulations, Dave!  A lovely 'find'  :hiclp: 

Now for your logic ...  ;)  Personally, I would agree firstly that your new Amethyst tazza was probably made by the same company as your vaseline one. 

Recently (and here I should apologise to KevH, as I was going to write a post about this but never got round to it  :-[ ) Kevin and I compared several pieces of uranium glass from my collection, and also some of his, under UV - both long and short wave.  We found that, for the most part, the UV 'matches' confirmed the ordinary light matches.  However, we did find that one particular piece of his matched exactly one of my uranium 'rustic' pieces in every respect - except that his was made in part uranium and part non-uranium glass!  :o 

However, looking at the leafy feet of your tazza, I can see both similarities and differences to the Walsh brocade piece in Mike Weedon's picture.  And I have many examples in my collection with leafy feet which look superficially the same, but have small differences in construction - for example, tooling marks.  Personally, I would not like to make a match from a photo alone.   

Likewise the twist in the stem.  I have a couple of items which have a similar twist in the stem, but I wouldn't assume they were made by the same company as your tazzas. 

As for Cyril Manley, I am not going to get into a 'debate'  ;) about the accuracy or otherwise of his attributions, as I have had my wrist slapped before on this subject  8)   However, I would simply say that some people think his attributions are wildly inaccurate, being based largely on anecdotal evidence (and indeed many have been found to be wrong, following subsequent research) while others trust his knowledge - strangely, for the same reasons!  He lived in the Stourbridge area and based many of his attributions on personal conversations with ex glass-workers from that area. 

I'm really looking forward to hearing what Bernard and Christine, amongst our other experts on this sort of glass, have to say about this!  :D


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Offline Lustrousstone

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Re: English Tazzas: one uranium/one amethyst
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2008, 09:33:10 AM »
I have nothing like this and can make no comment, except  :mrgreen: , sorry

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Offline Bernard C

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Re: English Tazzas: one uranium/one amethyst
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2008, 11:04:45 AM »
Leni —  I'm no expert.   There is too much truth in the old joke definition — An Ex is a has-been, and a Spurt is a drip under pressure.   I know my sources and handle the glass, and that's all, apart from, hopefully, always being open to new material, assessing it, and revising my views.

Dave — Your complex question is interesting.   You have linked it in with a competitor's website, so it could be unethical for me to respond in public.

It's also very refreshing after a couple of weeks in which virtually all interesting unmarked turn-of-the-century British fancy glass being offered in the USA has been described as either Webb or S&W.   Why do they choose those two from the dozen or so English glassworks around the country that made it?   The most amazing was "My opinion is Thomas Webb since I acquired this in Great Britain" on a fabulous example of Walsh Crushed Strawberry.   I will have to remember that one.   I could use it myself.   How about "This must be Lalique because I bought it in France"?

Bernard C.  8)
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