scottish vase ?? = Cellophane

[soledivo]

Andy, it doesn't sound like he's going to take notice of you and Frank.
I looked at his feedback, not awful but it would concern me.

martin

[Frank]

Peter is probably not that familiar with Monart/Vasart, although he does makes Ysart style glassware to and his is very thick walled.

Peter Holmes    1947 –     Caithness Glass: trainee 1963, Head of paperweight team. Assistant to Paul Ysart c1963– c1970. Made Caithness jewellery after Paul Ysart left to 1977. Established Selkirk Glass in 1977. Left Selkirk Glass in 200?

Now he can be found here: http://scottish-borders-art-glass.ecrater.com/

[Andy]

Thanks guys,
In my opinion, the sellers not doing anything wrong here , really, he has had it looked at,
and the fact that some agree and some disagree, makes me think its up to the buyer,and at that price,
it would probably only attract Monart collectors, who will have to decide for themselves!

Looked at Peter Holmes work, very nice, and very similar to both Monart and Cellophane,
this one in gold,
http://scottish-borders-art-glass.ecrater.com/product.php?pid=1134207
is very like the purple one ive just received, and put on here,
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,22328.0.html
although, i think mine is probably circa mid 20thC, (just by the age wear)

Regards
Andy

[Frank]

There is supposed to be an attributed example in the Passau Museum, I could not find it when there and there was no-one knowledgeable to ask... always meant to write to them but the years tick by.

Why it is not Ysart.
1. Colour Palette.
2. Mould blown.
3. Metal.
4. Shape.
5. Finishing.
6. Not Ysart technique.
7. Paul Ysart said it was not.
8. Ian said it was not.
9. Nigel said it was not.
10. Frank... etc. 

Why people think it is Monart.
1. Because sellers label it as Monart including 'reliable' auction houses.
2. Because it comes in two colours (This is of course a unique characteristic of Monart and Vasart)
3. Because Monart gets better money.
4. A Glass-maker told them it was.
5. Because it is stated as Monart on 'Is it Whitefriars' along with a rude remark about me 
 

Twenty-five years ago it was Schneider because
1. Because sellers label it as Schneider including 'reliable' auction houses.
2. Because it comes in two colours (This is of course a unique characteristic of Schneider)
3. Because Scheider was well known¹ and gets better money.
4. Monart was a complete unknown.
 :huh:

¹ Strange that a few years ago many visitors to this board did not know Schneider, but did know Monart.


Good job this one was not listed as a rare retro by a famous 60s designer working in London 

Perhaps I should take Ysartglass down permanently, save me some money.

[Frank]

Just noticed that postage to the Netherlands is 85  ounds!

[Andy]

Yeah, but,' Parcelforce Global Priority'  !!


Frank,
thanks, great info, very much appreciated,
I will keep looking for these, apologies if you have to repeat yourself over the years,
any info i find out, i will pass on!

 
Andy

ps .  but apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, a fresh water system, and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us?

pps, dare i ask, wot about my new purple bowl??
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,22328.0.html

[soledivo]

So thats how you make a profit, I knew I was doing something wrong 

[Frank]

No need for apologies, it is often better to iterate the full background of an attribution when dissenting voices are aired. Perhaps I should add a page to the web-site:

"Cellophane Glass - an alternative for cash strapped collectors of great glass."

With a subtitle:
"A 30 year hunt for the maker."  

- Of course it will push the prices up.

[Gary]

This vase poses more questions than answers, the vase has some Ysart styles i.e the whorl, gold aventurine and the thistle shape of the vase but there the similarity stops, it is much to heave, wrong type of pontil and it has a "cellophane" type decoration though only on the bottom half.
To add some info on the "cellophane" attribution Monart did do something not unlike that kind of decoration, shown here on the fourth pic which is Monart shape GE.


 

[Andy]

Gary,
its interesting, yours looks quite different to the other Cellophane examples,
id be interested in Franks opinion on it.
One just sold on ebay for a reasonable price ,
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130361024488&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

A bit off topic , Martin, the pics in the orig post, is the vase sitting on an Ercol table?
It looks the same as mine. 
Cheers
Andy

[Gary]

Hi Andy
I do have one vase more like the " usual Cellophane", which I bought on the dreaded eBay a couple of years ago as a piece of Monart, which I know now it is not, lesson learned as they say. A real heavy piece standing 19cm tall and 23 wide at the top.

Gary

[Andy]

Same colours as your Monart bowl
I quite like them, and i hope , one day, we find out where they came from!

Andy

[Frank]

I'd like to see clearer pics of the small bowl. The footed vase does not look like a cellophane. If it is heavier glass than Monart I would think it is Peter Holmes or Strathearn. With the vase larger pics  might help too. Tried lightening abd blowing up but no detail shows. Looks like vary different approach to decorating than the Ysart way. WMF Ikora is not impossible, not very likely.

[Gary]

Hi
Here are some more clearer!! pics.
Gary

[Frank]

The red blue is the same colours as in Plate 40 of Ysart glass and as I mention there usually found with white inner and on surface decorated. Probably Kugler colours so not surprising if we find a match to cellophane, but you would need to have it next to a piece of that to be sure it is the same. Of course the Ysart's made little use of translucent colours whereas all the cellophane is. The small size gives it greater intensity.

The other piece is not cellophane nor Monart but could be Scottish... or not.