Author Topic: Frank Eisner  (Read 11778 times)

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Offline Frank

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Frank Eisner
« on: August 24, 2005, 09:36:44 PM »
Kevin,

Frank Eisner joined James A. Jobling & Co in 1930, he was their first Continental glassblower. By 1958 Eric was working alongside him as a glass-blower.

From "Mixed Batch" 1958 - Joblings in house magazine.
Frank A.
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Offline KevinH

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2005, 10:23:38 PM »
Thanks Frank.

A few more finds like that and we may be able to start making some sense of things.  Now, I wonder if Joblings was his first UK position ... ??
KevinH


Offline Frank

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2006, 10:09:29 AM »
Some input on Eisner's from Adam Dodds:

Quote from: "Adam Dodds"
I knew Eric well for a very short time and I knew OF Frank, but during the period in between those you mention. (1930-1958)

In Summer 1948 I did eight weeks as a student (part of the course)at Lemington Glass Works and my home base was the chemistry lab.  Eric Eisner was the junior of the two chemists working there.  I suppose he was about the same age as me, 20, and we got on well.  I never met him after that but I heard later that he was manager of one of the Scottish companies.  I don't see how he could have been a blower unless he diversified when with his father.

Eighteen months after Lemington I had started work at Sowerbys, working with Andy Wemyss.  Although Andy started and ended his career at Sowerbys, at some stage (probably during WW II) he worked at Lemington and knew most of the people I had met.  He mentioned
Frank Eisner more than once.  I can't remember the context but I'm sure they would have met at Lemington. Andy had no first hand contacts at Joblings.

I can't remember much else but if you have any specific questions they might trigger some life in the old memory!


Followed up by:

Quote from: "Adam Dodds"
In describing Eric E. as a chemist, I may have been guilty of doing what I hated people to do about me!

In fact only the senior man (Ernie Walton, later at Sowerbys or Davidsons, after me) was the full-time analytical chemist.  Although Eric was based in the lab, and may have trained there, I think his duties were better described as glass technologist in that he was out and about in the factory and probably (not sure) reported to Bill Robson.  Bill had been he chemist before Ernie but by then was more or less a glass technologist.  Digressing, when I arrived at Joblings thirteen years later, Bill was already there and, in fact, was under me for a while before departing to Davidsons or Sowerby (whichever one Ernie wasn't at!).  We seem to have been an incestuous lot!


From Ian Turner:
Quote from: "Ian Turner"

I think I may have misled you about when Frank was working at Moncrieff's.  He was definitely there working alongside Paul because Eric told me - and others have confirmed - that Frank and Paul used to eat their lunch together and were sort of friends (if anyone could be described as a friend of Paul - he was not the most 'friendly' person at the works because he thought he was so much better than any of the others - which of course he was).  I have no evidence that Frank was there when all the Ysarts worked in the Monart shop, so I'd better withdraw that and stick to what I was told; i.e. that he was working there in the 50s and that Eric worked there until much later before he lost his job and became a furniture seller.  That I can confirm: I went to look at his shop!


Chipping away at it - I still have a few more trails to follow-up.
Frank A.
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Offline Frank

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2006, 08:16:49 PM »
Dave Moir added some more info:

Quote from: "Dave Moir"
Yes I do remember Frank. Jack Allan and I used to meet him for a beer on Saturday dinnertime.Eric would bring him and come back for him He was crippled with Arthrietis by that time but he was happy . He asked me to make a Crystal Ball for him and he told me how to make it.

I think he also worked at Leamington and Waterford The Weight he gave me was made at Waterford Unfortunately it has split in two did I not let you see it at Ysart meet?

I also know that he developed the glass Tubing for Radar sets at the onset of WWII. I beleive he was awarded the George Medal for this work. He had some work in Moncrieffs but I am not sure what he did

His son Eric was Chemist and Manager at Moncrieffs in the 60s and 70s the could have been there earlier I do not know Eric died about a month ago.


I also got a bit more from official sources but did not get the actual documents:

First some background for other readers:

There is an issue with paperweights that are reputedly made by Frank Eisner. Bohemian style flowers in a vase. It has been assumed that these were made at Moncrieff in the 30's but as I have proven he could not have been there prior to 1949 or later than 1964. After 1964, he did come into Moncrieffs at the weekend and would play around making weights - but the only metal available to him was MS1 (Moncrieff's borosilicate) which did not work with coloured glass and most cracked in annealing.

The area of the glassworks used by the Ysart's was STRICTLY off limits to anyone and the only known exception being his apprentice after WWII - Chic Young.


War record exists and suggests Frank was at least 14 by 1914 and thus retiring circa 1964/5.

"Description Medal card of Eisner, Frank
Corps Regiment No Rank
Middlesex Regiment G/98196 Private
Date 1914-1920 Catalogue reference WO 372/6 Dept Records created or inherited by the War Office, Armed Forces, Judge Advocate General, and related bodies Series War Office: Service Medal and Award Rolls Index, First World War Piece Denham W - Everitt H Image contains 1 medal card of many for this collection
"

He gained citizenship to the UK in 1919:
"Nationality and Naturalisation: Eisner, Frank, from Czechoslovakia. Resident in Birmingham. Certificate 4,740 issued 23 September 1919."

Which would imply he worked elsewhere before Leamington. From c 1930

Another official record may (or may not) be Frank: Initials F H J Eisner born 21-4-1894 and he would then have retired in 1959.


Getting closer :?:
Frank A.
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Offline KevinH

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2006, 03:39:21 PM »
Thanks for the additional info, Frank.

I have also had some extra snippets very recently from another source and this begins to tie together quite well.

I would appreciate the following comments and images being viewed solely as part of this message and not copied or used elsewhere. (Although the evidence is beginning to make sense, much of the detail still needs to be sorted out and anything taken out of context could be misleading. Also, I might change my mind on some of my current assumptions or conclusions!)

It is most likely that the "Leamington" referred to in Dave Moir's details was actually the "Lemington" (without the "a") that Adam D mentioned. This is a place [not marked on general UK road maps] adjacent to Newcastle Upon Tyne, where there was a very old glassworks which eventually was owned by Sowerby. Frank Eisner being at Lemington is backed up by a marked and dated item - sorry, but details not yet available for general sharing.

Dave M's commenyt about Frank Eisner also being at Waterford ties in with something else. I had already known for some time of a paperweight with very good etched details suggesting Frank Eisner worked for Waterford (but location may not have been the actual Irish place?) in the late 40s or early 50s.

Rgarding the type of "Eisner flower" weight we are talking about, these are not (usually?) "Bohemian style flowers in a vase". They are like those shown in my Ysart Glass conference images - some of which are shown below.

Two examples (profile only): http://i3.tinypic.com/vxozsy.jpg
These two show a typical form of the ground and of the flowers. The ground can also appear in other colours or even in clear glass. Most often the ground is decorated with scattered coloured bits.

The weight on the left of the above image was a "must have" since it has one whole cane (albeit misshapen) and some part canes which match to Ysart work! The weight also has a blue-purple tint to the dome, similar to that seen in some "1930s" Paul Ysart weights and various weights from early Vasart days. The Ysart cane is shown here:
http://i3.tinypic.com/vxp1g7.jpg

I bought two "Eisner" flower weights from the same source, one of which was a typical example. The other was rather different:
http://i3.tinypic.com/vxp1rm.jpg
Three of the flowers are of the same general form, bu the the fourth has many more petals. There are leaves, which is not a regular feature and the ground is a mottled green-and-white which is also not typical.

All examples I have viewed under UV have shown the same reactions - the same as early Ysart weights. But this does not prove they were made from the same glass as the Ysarts used. All it means is that the UV reaction suggests a soda-lime composition. Very similar results can be seen for various items from various countries. I have not therefore placed much reliance on the UV reactions of these "Eisner" weights to suggest attribution, except to say that they have all been similar to one another. It's the other evidence that is needed to confirm or deny things.
KevinH


Offline Frank

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2006, 06:38:22 AM »
Colin Mayor placed Frank & Eric Eisner as having been in Newcastle. This is also my supported by the Jobling documentary evidence.

Another reference I have is that a former Waterford glassblower at Moncrieff had made swan friggers - I will see if I can get a name to that, c1950 would tie in with the information but it is still an assumption, I will also try and get info from Waterford.

It may be worthwhile getting hold of more details on the George Medal award but that would probably need to be done in a UK library so over to you Kevin ;-)
Frank A.
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Offline Anne

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2006, 12:31:43 PM »
Quote from: Frank
Dave Moir added some more info:

Quote from: Dave Moir
I also know that he developed the glass Tubing for Radar sets at the onset of WWII. I beleive he was awarded the George Medal for this work.

Frank, this doesn't add up...  the George Medal dates from 24 September 1940 and was awarded mainly for civilian acts of gallantry.

From the Medal warrant signed by George VI...
Quote
The medal is intended primarily for civilians and award in Our military services is to be confined to actions for which purely military honours are not normally granted. ...   It is ordained that the Medal shall be awarded only for acts of great bravery.

The development of radar tubing was doubtless vital war work, but does not fall within the criteria given in the warrant, so if Eisner received a medal of some kind I would not think it to be a George Medal.


Offline KevinH

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2006, 06:52:30 PM »
Anne's doubt is valid.

The George Medal was the next level down from the George Cross but, like that award, was given for "Heroism" & "Great Gallantry". However. during the early period following its creation as an award, there were some alterations to the criteria for receipt. I was hoping that: "(c) acts connected with civil defence" would cover what we are looking for.

But then ...

The full list of recipients of the George Medal from 1940 to 1983 is given in the book Dragons Can be Defeated by Major D V Henderson. I thoroughly browsed that book today and there is, sadly, no record of any Eisner as a recipient, as a "Uk national", a "Foreign national" or an "Honorary recipient".

I plan to check another book, simply called Radar, which is probably available at a library not too far from me. I am hoping that this one may provide some technical or development points that could link in to the research.
KevinH


Offline mjr

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2006, 12:21:23 PM »
Was this ebay item (just ended) an Eisner? .  Looking at the examples above and those in Bob Halls Scottish book it looked like it was - or ois it just Bohemian?   Is it all down to flourescence?
Martin


Offline KevinH

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Re: Frank Eisner
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2006, 12:46:57 PM »
It has all the features of the majority of the ones attributed to Frank Eisner. A pity that a straight profile view was not shown (but I was happy with it from the two basic photos, so did not enquire further).

There seem to be quite a few of these weights around.
KevinH

 

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