Topic: New Molineaux & Webb items to view

[neilh]

There are some new photographs related to Molineaux & Webb on the Manchester Art Gallery website.

Type "Webb" into the search page at http://www.manchestergalleries.org/the-collections/search-the-collection/

You should see several new glass items and some personal objects once owned by the Webb family in the search results.

There is a brass snuff box dated 1802, owned by a Thomas Webb. His son, also Thomas Webb (one of the company founders), was given a silver cigar case on his retirement from Molineaux & Webb in 1859 and there is a photo of that as well. And they also have the bronze medal the company won at the 1851 Great Exhibition.

I've been researching my family history for the past couple of years and much to my surprise found that a few generations back from my (very poor) grandma Webb was the firm of Molineaux & Webb.  Together with a distant cousin or two we have been piecing together the history of people behind the firm and intend to put up a website in a few months with the results of the research.  It will be personal & business history, rather than helping people identify glass items, so I don't know how interested this board will be - but I'll let you know when it's done.

By the way, thanks to Bernie C and his previous posts - we might have missed the Webb / Percival family connection without reading this board.

[Mosquito]

Hello Neil,

Thanks for the link

I thought you might be interested in seeing this, a Molineaux Webb butter dish, as show in the 1927 Ctalagogue, p19 no. 73 (Thanks to Siegmar Geiselberger of www.pressglaskorrespondenz.de for the catalogue reference). The design was registered in 1884 and the piece has a very unusual reg. mark, as shown.

All the best,
Steven

[Bernard C]

Steven — I can't read all of the mark — what does it say?

Bernard C. 

[Mosquito]

Hi Bernard,
Centre Reads 'No. 4632', border reads 'Registered 30. April 1884'

Steven

[Bernard C]

Steven — Lovely!

Obviously the change of system at the beginning of 1884 rather left them rather puzzled as to what to do.   I've only seen one other example, a registration lozenge with an early 1884 registration number punched into it, rather than the usual letters and numbers, but that was a long time ago, and I forgot to note the details.

And it's not in Thompson.   There are many possible explanations, of which three are:-

They failed to pay the invoice on time, so the registration was cancelled,

It didn't get registered under Class III — Glass, but under another class,

The records at Kew have gone walkabouts, not unknown.

And it doesn't work.   4632 is 2–7 April 1884.   30 April 1884 is between 5849 and 6481.

Could it be a patent?

And it looks much earlier, more or less the same range as comport 178045, registered 27 August 1864, see Thompson p44.   Scanning down that page, there are two butter dish registrations with similar numbers, 186463 of 1 May 1865, and 247463 of 18 November 1870.   Note that early Molineaux Webb patterns were sometimes registered several times, one for each major shape, before they got into the swing of things.

Perhaps it was a 19 years on remake of the 1865 pattern mould!

Bernard C. 

[Frank]

If a patent then it is between 8th & 13th March 84. But it is not in Glass class 56

[Mosquito]

Bernard, It's interesting you mention 1864, I've had another look at the mark and the third digit is not clear, could be a six or an eight, it's a little squashed & not fully formed. I think I interepreted it is an eight as the no. was an 1884 registration. Another interesting thing I missed is that the wording around the no. says "REGISTER'D" rather than "REGISTERED". These are old pics, I'll try to get some better ones of the mark this weekend.

Steven.

[numbersandlozenges]

Gasp!!!!

I have had a dish with the same markings for years, and have been completely baffled until I saw this.

The number in the centre is very difficult to read, but the rest is the same, including "REGISTER'D" as opposed to "REGISTERED".

The oval on mine does not seem to be as near to the edge as the pictures I have seen, and I have not found a picture of the whole piece.

Is this the same item, and is there a lid missing??

Help!!

Nos & Loz