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Author Topic: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech  (Read 4460 times)

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Offline Jindra8526

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2008, 02:01:03 PM »
Marcus, have you any evidence about using Egermann as trade mark and as a label in period 1948-1989 ?
I have not seen it here.

The natioalised glass factories in Nový Bor had in this period a lot of different names, Borocrystal, Borské sklo, Crystalex... etc but never Egermann.

Jindrich

Sklounion

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2008, 03:07:19 PM »
Hi Jindrich,

The Egermann brand, is shown in Arnost, Drahotova, Langhamer. "Bohemian Glass" 1985, page 61 as a trade-mark of the Crystalex Branch Corporation.
Also page 182 of the same publication.

Regards,

Marcus

Offline Jindra8526

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #12 on: December 26, 2008, 06:28:24 PM »
Hi Marcus,
trade mark Egermann had been registered for Crystalex, and before for Borské sklo... etc.. traditionaly - in two forms - caption, and picture of Egermann.

I never seen it at label or used in promotional materials of Borocrystal, Borské sklo or Crystalex. As paper label it has been introduced after creation Egermann-Exbor s.r.o. as stated before.

Picture "stamps" show marks used surely in 1969 and picture "marks" in 1991. After that came chaos.
I do not know that book, is it really 1985 not 1995? 

I have Czech one from 1993 with the same name from the same persons, but this one was already written under the guidance Egermann-Exbor management. Designation Egermann-Exbor could not exist before 1992 so I am surpised how often this mistake is repeated in description of pieces from sixties and seventies. At that time has existed design atelier Exbor as part of Crystalex only - forget Egermann :-). 

JIndrich

Offline krsilber

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #13 on: December 26, 2008, 09:58:54 PM »
Quote
Designation Egermann-Exbor could not exist before 1992

Quote
2. Company
EGERMANN-EXBOR, s.p. (s.p. = state company)
Id: 00177105
Nový Bor, okres Česká Lípa
Founded: 31.12.1990
Likvidated: 4.10. 2000

3. Company
EGERMANN EXBOR - NOVOBOR s.r.o. (LTD)
Id: 00555045
Choceň, Husova 86, okres Ústí nad Orlicí
Founded: 01.10.1990
In bancrupcy since: 22. 9. 1997

I tried entering a whole bunch of companies in the company registry, many known to exist prior to 1990, and only one appeared with any information before that date (even then it was from 1988).  I don't read Czech, so I may have been using it wrong - all I did was enter the name in the first line and click "Vyhledat."

The full title of the book Marcus mentioned by Arnost, et al. is Bohemian glass. The History of Bohemian Glass and the Present at the Crystalex Branch Corporation Novy Bor.  It was published by The Crystalex Branch Corporation - Novy Bor in 1985.

Might it be possible that the "Egermann" part of the company name only appeared on pieces bound for export?  I have no idea, I'm just trying to make sense of the evidence.  Marcus and Jindrich clearly know more about this than I.

Sorry, Jindrich, I know you'd rather focus on identification than on details like this. :)  As I have been reminded in the past, it's important that the right information appear in these threads because it gets seen by others for years to come.
Kristi


"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Lustrousstone

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #14 on: December 26, 2008, 10:16:12 PM »
Egermann has been a Czech Republic trademark since 1966 and currently belongs to
Egermann, s.r.o.
Maiselova 15, Praha 1, Czech Republic, 11001
If you go here and type in U00000504805 (this was internationally registered in 1986 and in Slovakia in 1997) and E4221503, you will see

E744037 is a European registration dating from 1999

US registrations

If you go here, choose the search TM database option, and type in 0834494 you will see it was also registered in the USA in 1967
(REGISTRANT) BORSKE, SKLO, NARODNI PODNIK CORPORATION CZECHOSLOVAKIA NOVY BOR CZECHOSLOVAKIA

(LAST LISTED OWNER) CRYSTALEX, OBOROVY PODNIK CORPORATION BY CHANGE OF NAME FROM CZECHOSLOVAKIA NOVY BOR CZECHOSLOVAKIA

This registration is now dead but 0834494 is a live US variant


Exbor Czechoslovakia was registered in the USA in 1963 but is now dead
See     0753320
(REGISTRANT) BORSKE SKLO, NARODNI PODNIK CORPORATION CZECHOSLOVAKIA NOVY BOR CZECHOSLOVAKIA

(LAST LISTED OWNER) CRYSTALEX OBOROVY PODNIK CORPORATION BY CHANGE OF NAME FROM CZECHOSLOVAKIA NOVY BOR CZECHOSLOVAKIA

Offline krsilber

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #15 on: December 26, 2008, 10:42:42 PM »
Great site, Christine!  One of those things that makes me think, Why didn't I know about that before?  That will come in handy.  Nice work.
Kristi


"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Jindra8526

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #16 on: December 27, 2008, 11:46:10 AM »
Don´t celebrate friends,
the trademark registry I have checked as first and I suppose that everybody can - even not Czech language fan at

http://www.upv.cz/pls/portal30/ozfrm

(at example Egermann trade mark you can see that owner (factory) of this trade mark was not named Egermann, but Crystalex, Borocrystal, Borské sklo before 1989)

 
Nothing against fact that trademark "Egermann" has been inherited from the pre-war company to Borocrystal, Borské sklo, Crystalex, Egermann-Exbor s.r.o and then to Egermann s.r.o (which is currently dying).

This trademark, however, was not used for labeling glass until 1992. I have not found it in any single Crystalex, Borske sklo or Borocrystal leaflet, advertising material, etc before 1992. Labels I placed here yesterday are originals from conterporary documents.

So when you see paper label Egermann at any glass please take maximum care, this piece is very probably fabricated after 1992, when you see label Egermann-Exbor it is absolutely sure that it had been fabricated between 1992 -1997.

Jindrich

Offline krsilber

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #17 on: December 27, 2008, 08:31:16 PM »
What if the Egermann trademark was only used on exported items, though?  Maybe it doesn't appear in Czech literature for that reason.  There are items with labels saying Egermann Czechoslovakia (here, for example), so the trademark must have been used before 1992.
Kristi


"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Jindra8526

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Re: Ex B Or hand cut crystal vase.....czech
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2008, 10:36:19 AM »
It is generaly possible, Kirsty, of course. In such case I would expect it only on typical red Egermann's style pieces.
 
But I am still trying to focus you to short period in 1992 when Czechoslovakia has existed and Egermann label "Egerman Czechoslovakia" is documented. 
Jindrich

 

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