Author Topic: perhaps sklo union......hot worked  (Read 2426 times)

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Offline Jindra8526

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #20 on: December 24, 2008, 05:17:00 PM »
Å krdlovice web site is here:

http://www.beranekglass.com

The type we are speaking about is in Czech named "Hutní sklo", in German "Hüttenfertiges Glas", English simmilar equivalent I have not found.

Chřibska catalogue i nEnglish describes it follows:
 "off-hand shaped glass. In principle it comprises variously coloured products shaped by hand directly at the furnace. Manuall glass production founded on individual skills of the glassmakers.

Typical "Hutní sklo" fabricated in Chřibská, designed by Professor Hosef Hospodka see picture

Jindrich



Offline langhaugh

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #21 on: December 24, 2008, 07:19:50 PM »
Thanks for the link, which is useful, especially the older catalogue in a pdf file. I tried using various translation machines for your term but the only thing any of them came up with was "metallurgical glass."

If you do digitize any of the catalogues, I'd love to have copies. I'd be happy to help in any way, although my computer skills are, to be kind to myself, limited.

Where do people find this type of glass? Most of mine comes form Canada, where,as I've said a few times, its advertised as Chalet,

David
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Offline Carolyn Preston

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #22 on: December 24, 2008, 08:10:45 PM »
Bohemia (Bohemian) is another term. Czech republic (in history free Czech Kingdom and later Czech Kingdom as a part of Austrian monarchy) is composed from three parts: Bohemia, Moravia and Silesia. Bigger part of Silesia was lost in 18th century for Prussia...So the term Bohemia is designation for only western part of Czech republic, eastern is Moravia and north-east is a just bit of Silesia.

But what about the glass (typically lead crystal) which is marked as "Bohemian" but is quite recent. The etched crystal pattern which I chose for my wedding present crystal is such a type of glass.

I believe we have a copy of the label in the label gallery... http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2962

Carolyn


Offline Frank

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #23 on: December 24, 2008, 09:40:44 PM »
"Hutní sklo", in German "Hüttenfertiges Glas"

Literally that would be 'glassworks finished' but actually 'free-blown glass'.
Frank A.
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Offline TxSilver

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #24 on: December 25, 2008, 12:25:46 AM »
But what about the glass (typically lead crystal) which is marked as "Bohemian" but is quite recent. The etched crystal pattern which I chose for my wedding present crystal is such a type of glass.

I believe we have a copy of the label in the label gallery... http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2962

Carolyn

I believe Czech either refers to Czechoslovakia if the glass is made 1918-1993 and the Czech Republic if made afterward. Before 1918, we had to use the distinct states of the area, e.g. Bohemia. Personally, for companies that are in Bohemia, I still prefer that term. We don't have to worry about if it was Austria, Czechoslovakia, or Czech Republic. The glassmakers and borders may have changed with the politics of the area, but that is true for much of Europe in the past two centuries.
Anita
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Offline Jindra8526

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #25 on: December 25, 2008, 09:38:18 AM »
I did try to explain to you, thet Bohemia is designation for part of country - today Czech republic.

"Bohemian glass" is trade mark or marketing name for glass produced in Czechoslovakia and current Czech republic and has nothing to do with the place of origin, it can be produced also in Moravia. For example pieces from Rosice glassworks with label Bohemia Glass were made near the Brno, capital of Moravia.

So please do not mix place of origin with trade mark. (The same is with Pils or Pilsner beer). Original Pilsner beer comes from Pilsen, the town in western Bohemia :-).

It must not be so difficult for you. We also are able to understand that Edinburgh is not in England.

Arrogance "who takes a care" if Austria, Czechoslovakia, Czech republic is impertinent.

 


Offline TxSilver

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #26 on: December 25, 2008, 11:56:35 AM »
No slight or arrogance was intended. I should have added that if we know the company is in Bohemia, then using Bohemian to describe would not be wrong.
Anita
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Offline Carolyn Preston

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #27 on: December 25, 2008, 09:08:56 PM »
I did try to explain to you, thet Bohemia is designation for part of country - today Czech republic.

"Bohemian glass" is trade mark or marketing name for glass produced in Czechoslovakia and current Czech republic and has nothing to do with the place of origin, it can be produced also in Moravia. For example pieces from Rosice glassworks with label Bohemia Glass were made near the Brno, capital of Moravia.

So please do not mix place of origin with trade mark. (The same is with Pils or Pilsner beer). Original Pilsner beer comes from Pilsen, the town in western Bohemia :-).

It must not be so difficult for you. We also are able to understand that Edinburgh is not in England.

Thank you so much for this information. I've discussed these glasses on the forum before, (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,23519.0.html) trying to determine if they were etched, engraved or whatever. In that discussion, I have told of a small oddity in that my grandfather had glasswear of the same time which I believe came from his first marriage (to my grandmother). Of course, I have no way of know if they belong to the same "Bohemian" brand that my current glasses do or not. In another message thread, I mentioned that the brand was Balfor, but the label has "Bohemia" on it.

Now I'm confusing myself.

Carolyn


Offline krsilber

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #28 on: December 26, 2008, 06:55:41 AM »
Moderators:  Would it be appropriate to combine some of the posts concerning Czech and Slovak place names in one new thread?  It seems like the discussion is now spread among a few threads.

Quote
It must not be so difficult for you. We also are able to understand that Edinburgh is not in England.

I don't think anyone means any disrespect by the terms we are used to using for glass made in what are now the Czech and Slovak Republics.  Comparing it to knowing that Edinburgh isn't in England is a bit of an oversimplification I think, since Edinburgh never was in England, while the name of your "region" (for lack of a better word) has changed several times in the last 100 years.  In order to use the appropriate name, one must first know the date and location a piece was made - often a challenge in itself.  Different books call the same area by different names depending on when they were written.  Add to that the use of both German and Czech place names and the fact that some current companies have "Bohemia" or "Moravia" in their trademarks or describe their glass as "Bohemian" and the picture gets even muddier.  Even Viennese-designed glass is often described by the general term, "Bohemian."

So, I ask Jindrich to please have some patience with us!  It is confusing!

Quote
I believe Czech either refers to Czechoslovakia if the glass is made 1918-1993 and the Czech Republic if made afterward.
Just so Jindrich doesn't have to go over it, I realized in another thread that this is not quite true.  "Czech" isn't an adequate short term for Czechoslovakian at any point because it excludes the Slovakian part.

Kristi


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Offline TxSilver

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Re: perhaps sklo union......hot worked
« Reply #29 on: December 26, 2008, 10:18:53 PM »
The conversation in the different threads has been fascinating to me. I knew a good bit about the changes in the region in the 19-20th Century, but had concentrated mainly on the first 30 years of the 20th Century. I knew little about the post-WWII struggles of the glass industry. I have read what Jindra wrote and hunted down references that were available on the web. This is not an easy task -- there is so little in English that is easy to find. I learned that many of the companies had been sold to people in other countries, particularly France. This is rarely a good sign, because often the new owners lack the sentimental attachments needed to save or revive a company.

I am afraid we would be the proverbial salmon swimming upstream if we try to get the "Czech" classification dropped for glass made 1918 and after. I understand Jindra's words and agree with him about the historical importance. The states of the region have had a difficult past that was very cruel at times. The bankrupcies of the past ten years seem to be a continuation of the difficulties. The area will bounce back, I am sure. It always has.
Anita
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