Topic: amber jug: appeciate i.d help

[Pinkspoons]

Pip,

Just to throw a spanner in the works, here's a green Riihimäki Jug.    
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2227
I've never seen any of the rest of the Harlekiini in any colour but the turquoise one though.

robbo

Ah, I don't think this is Riihimäki... I saw one today in amber, with it's original 6 glasses, the spout isn't quite right, the glass was too thin, and the glasses that came with it were the wrong shape from genuine Nanny Still ones.

[robbo]

Ah, I don't think this is Riihimäki... I saw one today in amber, with it's original 6 glasses, the spout isn't quite right, the glass was too thin, and the glasses that came with it were the wrong shape from genuine Nanny Still ones.

Nic,

It's an intriguing one, isn't it? When you say the glass was thin, how thin, because I wouldn't say the green one is particularly so. Also, did the spout differ in a deliberate way?
Having looked through the pictures I've access too, there are some subtle differences between all of them—for example, the general inclination of the spout—which I suppose could be due to production inconsistencies.

On the green one and Pip's turquoise one the inclination of the spout looks less than on yours and that reproduced in "Nanny Still: 45 Years of Design", and the one in the 50s Finnish glass catalogues reprint book, resulting in a tighter curvature to the underside. However, the handle on Pip's, is more like the catalogue one, with the lower part nearly horizontal, whereas yours and mine are more inclined.

I'll take more photos of the green one tomorrow for you to look at, so you can compare with the amber one and your turquoise example.

Here's another one where the spout looks different again, and the handle is more like that in "Nanny Still: 45 years of Design":
http://pettueerikki.tripod.com/keremiikka/index.album?i=13

As we know, it's quite possible that another company made something very similar, maybe including my green one :lol: (thinking here of your Holmegaard "Copenhagen" / Maleras thread)

rob

[Pinkspoons]

Sorry, I was in a bit of a rush when I wrote my message - I'd only just got in and I was typing about the set I saw before I forgot whilst the bath was running (it was a very hot and dusty day on Sunday).

I meant that the glass on the glasses was too thin.  :oops: They were very lightweight and delicate with only slightly weighted bases.

On the amber pitcher (from yesterday, not the one at the beginning of the thread) the spout seemed too deep. The jug I had had quite a shallow spout by comparison. And the angle of the spout was a lot more inclined than even mine. I mean, this could be down to production variations, obviously - but it just seems strange that this one small part of the Harlekiini range was released in 3 (or potentially more) different colours.

I know there were other companies at the time making VERY similar jugs, because I've one in a very dark turquoise and incredibly thick glass, so it's entirely possible these different-coloured ones were made by someone else (it's even possible that Harlekiini-coloured ones were made by different companies, just to confuse things - as all the photos of genuine Harlekiini I've seen have the quite long handles, and all of our pitchers (except in the last link) have short triangular ones). I would have been tempted to buy the amber set, just to photograph and compare, if the num-nuts at the antique centre hadn't labelled it as Whitefriars and marked it up at £50.  :roll:

Edit: Another thing I've just noticed from photos of genuine pitchers that doesn't come across on any of ours.... the base of the jug should have rounded edges, whereas all of ours *seem* to be angular. Except in the one with the long handle.  :oops: I fear all of our pitchers might be knock-offs!  :lol:  I feel guilty about selling mine now.  :lol:

Quick snapshot of my similar one in very thick dark glass:

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b108/pinkspoons/blue-jug.jpg)

[Max]

I received a reply from the Finnish Glass Museum today:

Nanny Still ´s Harlekiini juice-jug       1743 150 cl was in production
      1959-1968 by Riihimäki glassfactory
                            1745 150 cl was in production 1959-1962
                            1746 100 cl was in production 1959-1968


In the book: Design 45 anni Nanny Still, The Finnish Glass Museum, Riihimäki
1996, is written:
Riihimäki made Harlekiini-series in green in the year 1969.

I don´t know what "valumatkeraava" means, because it is not correctly written!

Can you believe I forgot to ask if they made this jug in amber? <slaps hand onto forehead!!>  What an idiot!  :lol:

Not sure why the recipient of my email says 'valumatkeraava' isn't written properly, it's exactly as in the book, give or take a few dots over the a's.  :?

[Pinkspoons]

Ah, so they did make them in different colours.

I'm not sure if that helps or confuses things further?  :lol:

[robbo]

Max,
Thanks for that!
So it was made in green.

Here are some more photos:
Top
Spout
Base

Nic,
The one you've just posted does look significantly different, certainly enough to be a different manufacturer. Especially the handle, much more curved and lower down too.

I've just found another one on Huuto, with the triangular shaped handle and sharper base profile:
http://www.huuto.net/fi/showitem.php3?itemid=33183532
The fact it's in Finland is possibly a good sign?

I think it's very difficult to judge the significance of some the variations. I remember a thread some time ago about some quite striking differences in Riihimäki moulds. *If* the green one is Riihimäki, then it must be late, based on the dates given by the museum; so possibly there where differences from the early ones shown in the catalogues. :roll:

Max, which of the a's have dots on in valumatkeraava? One of the online dictionaries has a word "valumalli" which translates as moulding/casting/foundry pattern.

[Pinkspoons]

Nic,
The one you've just posted does look significantly different, certainly enough to be a different manufacturer. Especially the handle, much more curved and lower down too.

I've just found another one on Huuto, with the triangular shaped handle and sharper base profile:
http://www.huuto.net/fi/showitem.php3?itemid=33183532
The fact it's in Finland is possibly a good sign?

Oh, I didn't suspect mine of being Riihimaki for a moment - just in the same style. The handle, colour, glass thickness and spout are all completely wrong.

With regard the jug in Finland - I'm not sure. Everytime one of these jugs pops up on eBay UK (and there's one seller who's had a fair few of them.... 'gingertom...' something-or-other) they get snapped up by Finnish buyers. So there will be a few of the UK jugs with triangular handles and angled bases floating around on the Finnish market, I guess.

I just find it strange that there's an abundance of these jug sets in the UK and so few in Finland that they have to buy them in.

[robbo]

With regard the jug in Finland - I'm not sure. Everytime one of these jugs pops up on eBay UK ... they get snapped up by Finnish buyers. So there will be a few of the UK jugs with triangular handles and angled bases floating around on the Finnish market, I guess.

LOL didn't think of that! :oops:

[Max]

I had another email from the Glass Museum:

Hello again!

Now I understand what "valumat keräävä" mens. It means that if it fall down
drops from a goblet or jug this foot plate will collect those drops.

I have not seen Harlekiini in amber colour.

There is no book about Tamara Aladin´s glass production, sorry.

The 'foot plate' refers to other items in the Harlekiinit range.   She only says she hasn't SEEN Harlekiini in amber...not a definitive answer really.  :?

No books there on Tamara Aladin either.  

[Pinkspoons]

I'll see if I can barter down the price of the jug set in amber when I'm next there. I'll take along my Whitefriars catalogues and point out to them that they're wrong about its origins - should help me lever a good price on it. Because I'm intrigued now.  :lol:

And I can dream that's it's super-rare Harlekiini.... haha