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Offline Ivo

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blue vine cameo
« on: March 07, 2006, 04:13:13 PM »
(http://i2.tinypic.com/qy6alw.jpg)

Never come across anything like this before: Frosted ground and bottom like cameo, except you can feel the countours on the inside as if it were mould blown. Glossy vineleaves, polished rim, 12 cm / 5"high and really heavy.  Is this what is known as "faux cameo" ?
Ivo
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Offline Frank

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« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2006, 04:35:23 PM »
Isn't that term usually applied to some of Webb's glass? In which case it is. I have never read an account of how its done, probably to late for Hadjamach.. when is his 20th C book coming out   :x
Frank A.
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Offline KevinH

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2006, 01:56:27 AM »
The term "faux cameo" is one that I have not seen defined in any of my books. But it certainly is used a lot and there are plenty of google references in connection with both glass and general jewelry.

The use of the term seems to be for any item that looks like cameo work but was not actually, and wholly, hand-carved. This surely implies that any glass item that has been acid treated, even if finished with hand carving, is "faux cameo".

And yes, some people use the term for certain Webb vases from the 1930s. Here's a typical example I happen to have:
Whole thing ... http://i2.tinypic.com/qytngx.jpg
Signature part ... http://i2.tinypic.com/qytnki.jpg
But Manley spoke of "psuedo-cameo" and, taking references from the British Glass Between The Wars catalogue, the advertising literature of the time called the Webb pieces "Cameo Fleur".

The Great Glass site gives a reference (but not a definition) within the glassmakers section:
Quote
Peynaud
Bordeaux, France (1910 - 1945)
Glass refinery, "faux-cameo" enamelling, often in the Nancy style


Whether Ivo's vase is Peynaud, I would not like to say. It does not seem to fit the "enamelled" comment that Great Glass make. But it does look French(ish) to me. I don't think it's English. And note the difference in background finish between Ivo's and the Webb vase. The Webb ones are all (?) finished with the typical stippling to the clear parts.

One other point of interest is from Manley. He said, c1980, page 22 of Decorative Vistorian Glass,
Quote
To my knowledge, a type of pseudo-cameo vase has been around Britian for at 50 years. ... shaped like an Indian club ... very heavy ... a decoration of raised leaves and flowers beautifully enamelled ... seen scores of these vases sold as French and I have little doubt they are French, yet when Richardson's sold out in the 1930s, a number of these vases in various hspaes and sizes, were found in the glasshouse.


Hmmm.

Anyone know when the term "faux cameo" came into general use for glass items? And who first used it?
KevinH


Offline nigel benson

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2006, 02:14:18 AM »
Hi,

Frank, are you thinking of Thomas Webb's "Cameo Fleur"? (which can also, incorrectly, be referred to as "pseudo-cameo").

Similar wares were also produced by Richardsons and are called "Rich Cameo". The technique used to produce them is discussed in British Glass Between the Wars in the essay by Roger Dodsworth on Thomas Webb - see page 27, with a colour illustration on page 46.

I discussed this description with Michael Parkington and Hajdamach, amongst others, in the past. Thoughts were divergant as to the possibility of achieving the design using a dip mould as mentioned in the text with no consistant agreement, which I mention purely to open discussion.

Neither Webbs or Richardsons vases diplay the techique used on your vase Ivo.

Rims on their work are fire finished (rounded) as a rule and usually have a band of the same colour as used on the flower design around the rim. The background to the design can either be a polished random hexagonal shallow cut pattern, or a random 'frosted' stipple effect. Occasionally I have seen a roughened acid polished pattern - most usually on the abstract patterned vases, for which I have no official name. The flowers used on Webb's and Richardsons are most often Lilies or Tulips, but if you look in Christies sale catalogues for Parkington I (pg 40) & II (pg 38 ) you will see the full range of colours and two with rare flower patterns and finishes.

Nigel

Edit - Just posted and found your entry Kevin!


Offline KevinH

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2006, 02:16:01 AM »
Ah! Multi responses again. I was editing mine with a bit if extra detail while Nigel posted his. :D
KevinH


Offline nigel benson

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2006, 02:22:33 AM »
Hello again,

I also meant to say that your piece has a real continental feel/look to me, Ivo. Sadly I cannot say where from, but very attractive.

Nigel :)


Offline Ivo

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2006, 07:16:33 AM »
Thanks for the high quality replies. I agree with the piece being European, I am inclined to think of Belgium myself - I'll try and get to the ground of this.
Ivo
► BLUE HENRY ◄
 New Book: The Almost Forgotten Story of the Blue Glass Sputum Flask

all texts and pictures (c) Ivo Haanstra.


Offline Frank

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2006, 08:21:33 AM »
Yes Nigel, I must have done. Hadjamach does mention Cameo Fleur and Pseudo Cameo but points out that cameo fleur WAS acid etched.

Bernard, I struggle to get my head round the description of the process in Between The Wars.

Ivo's piece looks like the decoration was applied, which sems unlikely.
Frank A.
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Offline KevinH

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blue vine cameo
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2006, 03:39:39 PM »
A kind reader of this board has emailed me in reference to my earlier comment on "Peynaud".

They say that to the best of their knowledge, Peynaud always signed his pieces. An example they showed was of the cameo style that I would certainly link to the "school of Nancy" and the signature was of regular cameo style, too.

Ivo's item does not fit into the same style as the Peynaud piece I have now seen.
KevinH


Offline Frank

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« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2006, 08:33:26 PM »
faux cameo as far as jewellery is concerned is made two ways - two pieces glued, two colours moulded at the same time.

It is conceivable that you could get a 'cameo' type of decoration by applying lampwork or moulded design. Perhaps it is just one of those terms that people read somewhere and use it regardless. Or invented by a dealer/writer/collector.

The only other candidates I can find are:

1883 patent 2265 solution of fixed alkali, starch and water painted on, heated till dy, coated in Varnish to stop crumbling, then fired to fuse to the glass.

1885 patent 4776 for imitation embossed glass but the result would not be very thick - Design painted on glass with Copal varnish, after drying smoothed with Rouge. No firing.

A French Vitreous enamel process produced a one eighth of an inch high design that was opaque. It was only used in UK by the Sand Blast and Ceramique Co Ltd, London in the early 1900's after the French patent expired.
Frank A.
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