Looking for Glass on ebay? Angela's Designer Searches can help! Click here!

Author Topic: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?  (Read 4069 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3221
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #60 on: February 22, 2014, 10:25:07 AM »
I haven't time for this.   Bubblewrap and glass everywhere!!

Briefly, 1907 is circa 1910, so that's OK.

I can't find your reference, but Barbe's workshop certainly gilt decorated examples of Stuart "Peacock Eye" I've seen photographs.   Why not?   It was an independent decorating workshop.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline flying free

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 7232
    • UK
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #61 on: February 22, 2014, 10:48:07 AM »
Thank you Bernard.
And have a great and successful day tomorrow - I hope the weather is kind to you all.

Yes I know Barbe decorated for Stuart thanks :) 

What I wanted to know was whether the vase in CH British Glass Page 53 bottom picture left hand vase, was a Stuart vase.

Because I have a vase with the same decoration.   And I believe the vase in the book is Stuart , but it's captioned Thomas Webb and was donated to the Thomas Webb museum by Barbe's daughter having been given to her by Jules Barbe.

a) that causes some confusion if it's not a Webb vase but is captioned as being a Thomas Webb piece
b) it's rather ironic that a Stuart vase ended up in a Thomas Webb works museum
m


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3221
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #62 on: February 22, 2014, 11:43:06 AM »
Oops wrong book.   p53 vase in Hajdamach II is Stuart.   The caption is misleading.

Please would you take a close look at yours.   I've a fabulous and rare tall 12" example in canary opalescent with canary opalescent ribs, which could have been made by picking up rods and lightly marvering them in, rather than dip-moulding, as they protrude slightly on the inside, the opposite of what you would expect from dip-moulding.

Barbe's daughter may have assumed Webb.

These date from circa 1902.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline flying free

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 7232
    • UK
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #63 on: February 22, 2014, 12:03:29 PM »
 :-*

thank you so much!  I will copy and paste this discussion into my Jules Barbe thread if that is ok with you.

I have looked at my pair of Jules Barbe for Stuart vases (I think that is what you meant?) and there are no ribs.  The only 'bumps' that can be felt on the inside are exactly where the drop head dab trails have been applied to the outside pushing the inside in slightly.

I have also looked at my tall Stuart Peacock Eye vase and there are no ribs on that either - only 'bumps' on the inside where the trails and eyes have been applied and pushed in the inside slightly.

Your canary opalescent sounds amazing!

Thank you again.
m


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3221
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #64 on: February 22, 2014, 08:13:24 PM »
This afternoon I had one each of the four Stuart patterns discussed here side by side, i.e. dab trail, dropped head dab trail, Peacock Eye, and Barbe's daughter.   I'm now certain that Barbe's daughter was not trailed.  See for yourself tomorrow.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline flying free

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 7232
    • UK
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #65 on: February 22, 2014, 09:40:27 PM »
I'm  not there tomorrow  :'(
However, are you saying Barbe's daughter was mould blown with the trail pattern in the mould?
So that would be different of course to the one shown at the Stuart museum in clear with green trails.
You do mean the one on page 53 in CH British Glass 20th Century when you say 'Barbe's daughter' don't you?  Just checking.
My drop head dab tail is definitely applied not mould blown as is my peacock eye.

Since you say you had the 4 Stuart vases there, I'm assuming the identification of 'Barbe's daughter' as a Stuart piece is not affected by the revelation that it's not separately trailed?

m


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3221
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #66 on: February 23, 2014, 12:26:09 AM »
What I am saying is that my example of the Stuart pattern shown on p53 of Hajdamach II (Barbe's daughter) is far too precise and even for trailing when compared with my examples of the other three patterns.   The only technique I can think of that would fit this precision is picking up rods of colour (or the same colour) from a spacer and marvering them in, a technique I have seen used at Formia.   There may well be other techniques that would produce the same effect.

Bernard C.  8)
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot


Offline flying free

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 7232
    • UK
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #67 on: February 23, 2014, 10:18:38 AM »
Thanks for explaining - I didn't understand :)
therefore all the plain ones without peacock eyes and just trails,might have been done in this way.  I would make it quicker wouldn't it? and more consistent?
m


Offline flying free

  • Members
  • **
  • Posts: 7232
    • UK
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #68 on: March 16, 2014, 12:34:11 AM »
Bernard please can I just check something with you?
On this reply you mentioned a couple of pieces that were found in the Stuart collection that weren't Stuart -
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,46323.msg316447.html#msg316447

I didnt' realise the Walsh waterlily centrepiece was found in the Stuart collection -   I think the Corning have said they bought it believing it was Carder but found the rd number afterwards?  Was that from the Stuart collection?
Sorry for doubting you,but I just thought I'd check  :)
m


Offline Bernard C

  • Committee
  • Members
  • *
  • Posts: 3221
  • Milton Keynes based British glass dealer
Re: peacock eye trailed vases - Stuart or Walsh? late 19th or Edwardian?
« Reply #69 on: March 16, 2014, 12:23:13 PM »
Did I say that!   I must have been distracted.   ;D

The Walsh water lily centrepiece was in the Stevens & Williams collection at Honeybourne House Museum, and is famous (or infamous) for Simon Cottle at Sotherby wrongly listing it as S&W in the auction, and later publicly apologising for his mistake.   This is possibly the only time in history that an auctioneer has ever apologised for anything.

So it's at CMOG.   That's useful to know.   Thanks.   Is there a picture of it online?

Bernard C.  8)

ps - never rely on anything I say when I'm distracted.   Possible reasons include a surprise visit by the grandchildren when I have glass unpacked for sorting;  a pending visit to the doctor, dentist, optician, or ear specialist;  the OH threatening me with a haircut;  or a pending one-way trip to the vet with our own or a neighbour's cat or other pet that's passed its sell by date.    ;D
Text and Images Copyright 200414 Bernard Cavalot

 

Search
eBay.com
eBay.co.uk

Link to Glass Encyclopedia
Link to Glass Museum
Enter
key words
to search
Amazon.com