Topic: Machine threaded over patterns ID request

[albglass]

This general topic was discussed under a query about Moresque glass, but the pictures and webpages that were referenced are no longer available (except for one picture of salts).  From the dialog, I don't think any of these examples would have been discussed.  There was one piece that had diamonds, but it was described as "Ruby body, diamond moulded, amber threads" while my diamond bowl is amber glass with ruby (cranberry) threads.  I was wondering if the first picture of the vase could possibly be Moresque, but it is clear threads over clear glass and other references to Moresque have had a colored body.  The plate with the flower petal bottom has a ruby glass center fading to an amber outer body and has amber threads.  The striped plate is clear glass with ruby (cranberry) threads.  I know at least four English glassmakers made this type of glass.  Are any of these patterns recognizeable?  Thanks for your help!

[Bernard C]

Cathy — Your first example (001), the clear vase that looks yellow to me, is definitely Stevens & Williams Moresque.   The underlying moulded pattern of interlocking ogee-shaped arching is shown in the drawing accompanying S&W's registered design No. 137288 of November 4, 1889 (see Gulliver p.266).   Colour, or the lack of it, is irrelevant.   Don't worry about the lack of a registration lozenge.   As a US export piece, a lozenge would have been meaningless, and, worse, it would have indicated to US glassworks that the pattern could have been freely copied for the US market without fear of legal action.

Your fourth item, the threaded plate, is a mystery to me.

003 and 002 are very similar in both colourway and underlying pattern to a tazza that I had through my hands recently, which I had attributed to Frederick Stuart, apparently privately developed by him while in the Stuart & Mills partnership, and launched by him on the dissolution of this partnership and his acquisition of the lease of the Red House glassworks from Philip Pargeter in 1881.   The launch of a tazza in this style on its own would not have made marketing sense, so it is reasonable to assume a variety of shapes.   Gulliver (2002) p.199 bottom left shows such a tazza, here not attributed.   But that was ten years ago, and it was Mervyn Gulliver who pointed out to me that the tazza he had not attributed in his book was actually Stuart pattern No. 3890, with a pattern book date of around 1882.   He has also found other shapes, for example pattern 4009 was a shallow bowl with a gently crimped rim and three scroll feet.   His example of 4009 had 14 crimps around the rim, just like your 002.   These two are, without any doubt whatsoever, Frederick Stuart, Red House Glassworks (Stuart & Sons from 1885).

Bernard C. 

[Bernard C]

More thoughts on the colourway of 003, 002, my own and Mervyn's tazzas.

Cathy — I was fortunate to have my tazza in my possession for a long time, so I became very familiar with it.   Despite this, and despite examining it from all angles, with a loupe, and in various types of light, I am still not sure what colours were used.   I was hoping for an example from the range with a deeply ground out and polished pontil scar, and/or a damaged example — which might have resolved my uncertainty.   I thought I could see green in there somewhere, and couldn't figure out where that came from.   I didn't eliminate the possibility of the main glass being cased, made up of different layers.   I'm still not completely certain that there isn't air-trap in there!

You seem more certain.   Have you considered other possibilities?

Bernard C. 

[albglass]

I am not seeing any air-trap in the diamond patterned bowl, so I don't think it was cased, and the colors are fairly obvious (amber with ruby threading).  On the other hand, the flower petal patterned piece is partially cased using amber and ruby glass.  There are teeny tiny bubbles in a line all around the outline of the petals and the lower diamonds (it's hard to see the diamonds in the photo).  I am not sure that such small bubbles would qualify it as a air-trap piece, but they are there and accentuate the outline of the pattern.

I think the striped low bowl or plate is quite interesting, although I haven't figured out how it was made.  It is only 6 1/4" in diameter, with a large, highly polished pontil mark.  There are 90 stripes in this piece, and the threading undulates over the stripes and dips down between the stripes. However, the dips look pressed down as if a crimping tool was used, but that doesn't make sense.  In any case, the effect is quite striking.

[flying free]

See information in this thread re maker being id'd as Stuart and also as Thomas Webb - confusing:

http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,60786.msg342759.html#msg342759