Topic: J. C. Cottle decanter Rd. 744629

[Paul S.]

I appreciate we have a pic of this particular decanter on the Inchicore link in Anne's first post, but have added another of our own, including side and base shots which show clearly the massive base kick.          This one does carry the Regd. No. 744629, which runds down to 2nd April 1929 - and the base also shows upper case letters TZ in relief  -  no dount some factory reference code.

The following is an effort to bring together most of the Board's information on these Cottle type mould blown decanters, and since I'm only just starting to take an interest, do shout if I'm getting it wrong.

If you try J. C. Cottle on the Board's search there's really only one entry of any substance regarding this Londond based 1920 - 1930's importer of that name - and trying 'cordial decanters' doesn't seem to offer anything new.

This is a link from an earlier post by Anne...    http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,34789.msg216889.html#msg216889 .. in which Chris Harrison provides some info from the Great Glass web site, and Bernard describes many of these eastern European pressed decanters as 'cordial decanters', and gives some background to their history.

This recent decanter posting from Fred.......  http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,51853.msg294052.html#msg294052
has also been suggested by Bernard as being a possible J. C. Cottle import (or maybe Lang)  -  but confirmation will have to wait until I go to Kew again.

And in the only other entry I could find....   http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,29154.msg157835.html#msg157835
Bernard says  " a good number came with a standard "cooking" stopper design.          Is anyone able to explain what sort of stopper this is please??

Mould blown table glass and decanters have been around it seems for a long time, although historically they were apparently more common in poorer countries like France and America, and although originally decanters were blown manually, it seems ingenuity came to the fore and various mechanically means were devised, which obviously saved the blowers lungs.             So, we should avoid using the word pressed, and simply called these decanters mould blown.
There is a very comprehensive chapter in Andy McConnell's 'Decanter' book - regarding C18 and C19 moulded decanters, and well worth reading, alghough regrettably it doesn't cover C20 moulded examples.
Presumably, the reason for importing these things from the Continent in the early C20, was the same reason we import goods from the middle and far east now.

Style wise, 744629 is obviosly borrowing heavily from the Georgian/Regency period - with this substantial kick, the large imitation relief diamonds and pretend slice cutting to the body, plus the mushroom shapped stopper.

In view of these features and the overall shape, would Bernard still feel happy describing 744629 as a cordial decanter?





   

[David E]

Personally, I've always had a problem with glassware of this kind being called "mould-blown" or "pressed". The former alludes to a mouth-blown, hand-crafted product and the latter is misleading as there is no pressing action from a plunger. Rather, would calling them "machine-blown" be better?

However, the technology to create such glassware was developed purely to increase production, not to save glassblowers' lungs 

[Paul S.]

I suppose you could argue that the pattern is 'impressed' from a mould, but I'd disagree that we should dispense with the word 'mould' - after all it is only by means of using a mould that this type of surface decoration is achieved.
I can't imagine things like this were ever produced by anything other than a mechanically mould-blown process.........no doubt compressed air in the C20, rather than the bellows of the C19.

You're quite right of course about the economics of production being more important to factory owners that the niceties of blowers lungs, although there is some evidence of a reverse situation from the records of Baccarat.         It seems that around 1820, one of their blowers by the name of Ismael Robinet, was threatened by the onset of tuberculiosis which would have put paid to his working abilities as a glass blower.               It seems he invented a method of mechanically aided blowing called 'moule en plein' , which involved some form of bicyle pump type thingy with a piston - and in the process saved his lungs - earned a pension from Baccarat - was given a gold medal, and an award of Fr. Fr. 8,000.
Apparently part of the wording of his citation from the Academy of Science said ..........'blah, blah, blah.......and aiding the health of the glassmaker'....
Also .......'Saint-Louis introduced 'mechanical moulding' from an early date.

I suppose it was o.k. provided you didn't suck

[agincourt17]

Photos of four different J.C. Cottle-registered decanters, but all have apparently similar stoppers. Perhaps they are what Bernard means by standard ‘cooking’ stoppers.

Interestingly, 'my' RD 744629 decanter has a different stopper to Paul's example.

P.S. the 'TZ' on the underside of the RD 744629 probably stands for Tzechoslovakia (or something similar) as I can imagine most most of the decanters were manufacturered there.

[agincourt17]

Another J.C. Cottle-registered decanter, but this time without a standard ‘cooking’ stopper. The stopper it does have, a heavily-faceted globular type, is almost certainly a mismatched replacement.

[Paul S.]

thanks  -  sorry, I still don't understand why the use of the word 'cooking' in this sense, what is it implying - am I just being thick?

Unlike more expensive cut decanters, I'd imagine most, if not all, of these mould-blown examples have ill-fitting stoppers - and I doubt that any are number matched - so difficult to tell for certain if any given one is the correct partner for the body it accompanies.

I have another example of this type of decanter, with a similar style of patterning - for which as far as I can tell there isn't a pic on the Board - but unfortunately it's without a Rd. No.        It's so strikingly similar that it has to be from the same period and probably another import  -  I'll make a separate post for it.

[agincourt17]

A couple more JC Cottle-registered decanters for comparison:

RD 728965 of 27 April 1927. Definitely a non-standard Highland piper metal and cork stopper (presumably for a whisky decanter rather than a cordial decanter).

RD 731053 of 23 July 1927. Standard Cottle stopper again.

I took Bernards's term 'cooking' to imply 'everyday', 'ordinary','stock', or 'non-bespoke' (sounds a bit like the euphemisms for 'dead' in the Monty Python parrot sketch) rather than individually designed or fitted.

[Paul S.]

I'm impressed - you've done well with these things Fred.      They make a good collection.
Nope, still don't get it  -  surely someone doesn't use the word cooking unless there's a kitchen/culinary/food connection - or do they

[Anne]

More examples in this topic: http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,34789.0.html

I extracted the Cottle RD nos. from Great-Glass and Blue Book lists into a spreadsheet a while ago - there are 46 51 of them dating between 1927 and 1931, then 1 more dated 1936 - making 52 in total (so far found) all seen so far are decanter/bottles. Cottle himself died in 1937, aged 57, which explains why there are none later than this.

Mod: Edited to amend the number of RD nos. found as a result of Paul's visits to the Nat. Archives.