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Author Topic: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim  (Read 4959 times)

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Offline Lustrousstone

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2013, 12:15:25 PM »
Which is what I'm saying. The tricorn and the inside out are based on the "hint of green blue colourant", and the fish and the vase are based on shades of cobalt blue.

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Offline glassobsessed

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2013, 12:25:46 PM »
Except both are made with the 'sky' blue which is not cobalt based. The camera does not distinguish these two blues well, I will bring one to the next National and you can take a look.

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Offline Lustrousstone

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2013, 12:38:10 PM »
How do you know the sky blue is not cobalt based?

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Offline flying free

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2013, 12:41:41 PM »
Ok, just so I follow this before I add my comments :)
John you are saying that neither your inside out or tricorn are cobalt at all - I agree - let's forget them.
But you are saying that your fish and your vase in the second photo are both 'decorated' with external wings/trailing made of cobalt,however the base body of those two pieces is actually not cobalt - right? 
and that the camera is lying when it shows your fish for example to have a more transparent layer of cobalt as it's middle body and neck/rim but thicker cobalt as it's wings? yes? because only the wings on the fish and the outer layer of trailed decoration on the vase is actually cobalt?
I agree with you and I'll say why in a mo, if I've understood you right :)
m

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Offline glassobsessed

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2013, 01:06:13 PM »
How do you know the sky blue is not cobalt based?

They are two different tones of blue.

Yep, that sums up my ramblings very well m. ;D

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Offline flying free

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2013, 01:31:37 PM »
ok :)
I know what you mean.
My fish vase is a kind of turquoise.  Certainly the neck rim and middle body bit is a kind of  turquoise. Indeed it looks quite  close to a teeny bit of turquoise I could find on a textured square vase but that was difficult to compare because of the amount of chlorides in it really.  I've held it against a Sklo Union pressed turquoise glass bowl on one side and on the other side, a  piece of George Elliot cobalt glass.  The GElliot cobalt glass is much more transparent than the sidestripe, even viewing through two 'sides' front to back (and looks to be a similar/the same cobalt used by MH on the sidestripe), and my fish is definitely not cobalt, definitely leaning more towards a turquoise base glass than cobalt.

 However, on very close inspection there are faint darker cloudy streaks/smudges in the wings on my vase.  I am unsure whether they are shadows of the swirls of the glass from turning and winding the wings on, and therefore a trick of the light,  or whether some darker cobalt blue has smudged it's way into the wings.  It's not the reason why it appears transparent cobalt blue in the photos - that is a camera problem I believe -  but it could contribute as to why my fish looks as though it's a paler cobalt version of the sidestripe.

So I now know what you mean John.  When you've talked before about your cobalt fish only having cobalt wings, I could NOT understand what you were talking about as it looks all cobalt in the photos  ;D  but now I understand completely.
So, once I get my camera back this evening I will try and take some pics with the fish against the Sklo turquoise and the George E cobalt to try and show where the colour leans towards.  The sidestripe is the cobalt of your fish wings and the trailing on the cobalt vase in the same pic you just showed above.

m

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Offline glassobsessed

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2013, 01:50:55 PM »
Turquoise seems as apt as sky as a description (back to the hint of green).

Perhaps this photo will show the two colours in the fish vase better.

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Offline flying free

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2013, 11:25:20 PM »
right, I've also had a good look at my fish again today and this evening.

And what I'm pretty sure of is that the neck and button rim and the v shaped bit that goes down into the vase is some kind of different blue to the wings - not the same as the turquoise blue on my inkwell that has a polished pontil mark, and not exactly the same as the Czech turquoise bowl either (my camera picks that up as turquoise but not the mdina fish as turquoise and the fish isn't the same degree of turquoise as the bowl), but it's also not cobalt blue as far as I can tell.
However my vase also has the neck cased so the best place to show the different colour of the blue is at the low point of the v where it joins the cross of the wings as it were.  In the first photo that point is where it looks the brightest clearest palest blue if you can see that?

However, what I can say is that the wings of my fish have cobalt blue swirls in them.  And looking at it with fresh eyes, that is probably why I asked when I first bought it, if it was a cobalt fish vase :)

I only had camera back from son this evening so I've had to take pics under artificial light - I don't know if these will work but I will try again in daylight tomorrow and add some more.

My comparison is to a G Elliot vase that has a slightly purply cobalt neck, I think it's slightly purply and not quite exactly cobalt to be honest, but it's near as dammit to the cobalt sidestripe and it shows the comparison better because it's a little more transparent than the sidestripe.
On that photo you should be able to see the cobalt streaks in the wing of the fish vase as a comparison.

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Offline flying free

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2013, 09:12:34 AM »
see above for pics taken under strong lighting back lit to show the colours as best I can.

The pics below are taken this morning.  Not in great daylight, but all natural light.

In the first pic, I've compared the fish to an Adolf Matura ashtray which is a deep turquoise.  The fish vase (neck/rim/v part base colour is a slightly deeper version of this turquoise.  The Matura ashtray often looks blue in photographs as well unfortunately as the camera does not like this tone of turquoise but they are a similar tone.

In the second pic you can see that the cobalt sidestripe is a completely different colour to the Matura ashtray.

In the third pic of all three you can see how much cobalt there is in the fish vase wings, which the camera is picking up .  In real life it has the cobalt swirls in it, but doesn't display as cobalt as the sidestripe.

So in short, the fish has a deep turquoise base colour, with the wings having cobalt blue swirled through them but the neck, rim and v dip part not having the swirls although the casing of the wings is drawn up the sides of the neck so it does affect the colour a bit on photographs ... however it displays as a deep jewel like turquoise.
Hopefully photo 4 taken against black will show the difference in tone between the two.

Having now taken the pics, I think the cobalt in the wings is actually distorting the cameras' ability to pick up the colour and I wonder if that is also why John's centre neck and v also will not display as the deep jewel like turquoise on camera.


m


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Offline glassobsessed

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Re: Early Mdina cobalt blue sidestripe button rim
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2013, 01:04:08 PM »
It could well be a bit of the cobalt giving that colour to the wings m (lovely photos btw).

I could not decide for sure if the swirling blue in this fish vase could be from that (fabled) cobalt pot or not: https://picasaweb.google.com/Johnmj100/EarlyMdinaGlass#5625165243366066546
On reflection and comparing the blues side by side I think it probably is but it is not something I would like to bet on.

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