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Author Topic: Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?  (Read 5653 times)

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Offline Frank

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2006, 06:34:22 PM »
What do you folks think of these pieces?



I had no response re Kley-Blekxtoon yet but am still trying.

Offline Frank

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2006, 06:43:18 PM »
Incidentally Jean Luce opened his design studio in 1931.

Offline glasshypo

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2006, 12:25:39 PM »
hello Frank,

Nice picture, resembling very well the photo’s of Sydney’s glasses.

Could be the bell is somewhat wider at the foot, but than it is handmade and differences are often found in handmade glasses. The decanter fits lovely to the glasses. The shape of the known Carex decanter (seen in one of the pictures of Jay) is one based on an old, very often used, design from the Gilde service. Only there the stopper differs to match the square form of the foot of the Carex glasses.

The shape of the decanter in your picture (where on earth did you find this???, very curious) differs from any Leerdam decanter I have ever seen.

So at first glance, this is the service Sydney is looking for. As the decanter also differs from Carex as pictured, think Sydney’s glass service is a different service all together and most probably not Leerdam.

Botterweg with a lot of knowledge (known to you I presume?) and other glass dealers are all convinced (Sydney contacted a lot of dealers) this is not a Leerdam glass service.

Only thing I could imagine that it was a prototype, which could than explain why nobody knows this service. The shape of the decanter I personally find to be not Leerdam, but that is just my feeling, which is of course very subjective.

But then, if it was a prototype, you probably would expect, as it is a family service Sydney inherited, this would have been known in the family to be a unique service.

So for this time being, not having an answer from v.d. Kley-Bekxtoon, still think this is a “foreign” (not Dutch) service.

So Jean Luce still looks very possible to me.

Don’t leave me (us) in the dark too long, am very curious where you found this picture.

Offline Jay

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2006, 03:39:19 PM »
Hi all (apologies for temporary absence due to deceased technology, now replaced, back, big and bouncy)

I don't have anything to add except more questions...

I've looked closely at my own examples of these and similar products and designs from the period. This design has a square form and a curved form (obviously) and they are attached which seems to have been quite a technical challenge. In the assumption that they date any/somewhere between 1915 and 1960 and are made of thin glass, and given the flared rim, the bowl must surely have been blown NOT by a machine. But the technique for the foot, and the means off combining the two are the essential characteristics.

The flared rim is typical of Copier's Romanda (and others) so the bowl-shape is a feature which does not exclude Leerdam or Maastricht.

Sometimes the 'design-solution' seems to be to cast small squares of glass and then attach them to the base of a separate (blown) stem. The (slight) height variation seems to focus on this spot, suggesting that the two forms have been 'glued' together with slightly more or less 'glue'.

I would also be also interested to know from Sydney whether the thickness of the foot is identical, or scales slightly with the various models.

Some have a foot which looks (almost) pressed and similar designs have a smaller square added into the sandwich.
Sufficiently detailed images are beyond me!more than my eyes or my camera can manage.

This is also a design which is a challenge for production. It is hard enough to hand-blow identical glasses, but the rigid geometry of the foot is even more unforgiving.


I note as well that Frank's illustration seems to allow for a broader contact between the curved bowl and the square base, but then, it's an illustration, and it certainly wouldn't surprise me if the actual manufactured object was slightly narrower at the 'join'. (Maybe they got better at making them then the early version provided to the illustrator ;-))

Finally I am a little concerned that we have two very simple forms and we cannot exclude the possibility that the same inspiration has struck in several places.

Come on Frank! Pull back the little black curtain and we'll all gasp at our own foolishness.
Dutch 20th Century Factory Glass

Offline Frank

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2006, 04:05:35 PM »
First, the illustrations are almost certainly photographic, photo-mechanical.

But what is really significant about these is that they represent the breaking moment of Art Deco and were exhibited at the Exposition Des Arts Décoratifs et Industriels in Paris, 1925.

The suite was called "Pour le Yacht" and appeared on the opening page of the catalogue for the company Compagnie Des Cristalleries de Baccarat.

Of course we still do not know the designer.

Offline glasshypo

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2006, 06:04:12 PM »
Nice find! Interesting as well. Very important exhibition at that time and of course still is.

The glass service of Copier named Smeerwortel was awarded a silver medal at this exact exhibition in Paris. Most likely Copier was there at the exhibition and was inspired, as will others have been.
Perhaps he took a glass (the one in the picture) home???

Would indeed be very interesting to know the designer.

Offline Frank

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2006, 06:26:37 PM »
I have written to Baccarat about this and another item in the catalogue which might be even more important.

Offline glasshypo

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2006, 06:29:40 PM »
Willing to share the other important item? This is a nice "jacht" (Dutch for hunt).

Offline Frank

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #28 on: August 04, 2006, 06:36:05 PM »
I will be, but it is being discussed off board at present. Maybe next week. I doubt it will be as exciting for you though :wink:

Offline sydamsterdam

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Looking for this kind of glassware... Leerdam Carex?
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2006, 09:31:59 AM »
Hi All,

I'm happily surprised that you're all still working on it!  It seems more difficult than any trivial pursuit question, though. The image that Frank added is indeed quite interesting, however, to me it seems that the designer of 'my' glass was inspired or simply stole the design. My set is really handblown/handmade. Even though I don't know much about it, every glass (even the same sized glasses) all have slightly different sizes, with slightly different thicknesses of the square stem. My glasses are 'glued' higher on the stem and it seems that these stems aren't flat, like mine. I've added two more (and better) images made from a different angle. Just go to my initial message and link. You can definitely see how clear the glass is. The black and white image that Frank added also shows that very slender looking glass on the left, of which I don't have an example here. I don't think it was ever part of this set I have. Neither do I remember the karaf.
It was also suggested that this set was never actually in production and that we're talking about a prototype kind of set. Could be, maybe my grandmother bought a showroom set for a great deal? It's possible... And maybe that's the reason that it's not found anywhere else, except for a few lost pieces in this world. There may only have been a few showroom sets made by.... Leerdam?. It's one of the most likely solutions, especially since only one glass is in that Leerdam catalogue and that Carex was actually derived from this one (because it was too expensive to produce the original design). It makes sense. It was all about money in the end  :? .
Sydney

 

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