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Author Topic: 17th century Italian jug for show.  (Read 482 times)

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Offline brucebanner

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17th century Italian jug for show.
« on: May 07, 2017, 09:54:48 PM »
I'm pretty sure this is ancient after looking at two in the Murano museum, purchased today at the glass fair and the two i have seen before are on page 110 Murano island of glass book by Attilia Dorigato.

There is another online which looks like it has had a foot and ball knop added at a later date?.

4 1/4 inches tall, 2 1/8th inches across the rim and 2 1/2 inches across the base.

Regards Chris.
Chris Parry

Offline brucebanner

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Re: 17 century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2017, 09:56:48 PM »
More pics.
Chris Parry

Offline glassobsessed

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2017, 07:46:57 AM »
I would assume late 19th C, a lot of glass from Murano was sold in this country at that time, far more likely than 17th C in my opinion (how much 17th C glass arrived on these shores?). I have had dozens of late 19th C Murano items pass through my hands in the past few years and have often wondered how I would be able to tell for sure if I did bump into a much older piece.

Given that, I see nothing in your photos that looks out of place for a late 19th C item sold by Salviati & Co. A tricky area as traditional forms were made for many centuries.

John

Offline brucebanner

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2017, 08:01:28 PM »
Could be John, it's near identical to the piece in the museum i was inches away from and a boat shaped one, there are  three online, although being so old old why are there a few of them about?, i picked a piece of signed webbs bronze up from a flea market in Barcelona a couple of years ago, the glass fair was full of glass of all ages  from all over the world.
Chris Parry

Offline oldglassman

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2017, 10:05:01 AM »
Hi ,
              having had a good look , my two pence worth would be that you have a piece dating from the late 17th to early 18th c however an attribution to Venice is very difficult , the origins of this form are certainly Venetian but it wasn't long before glass in the "Facon de Venise" style was being made concurrently in the Low Countries , France and Spain,

Looking as best I can at the metal of yours I would think Low Countries could be as close as you can get without it actually being seen in the hand, it also looks like there is something odd going on at the base , dimples of some sort , footless examples are known but these are most often seen with either and applied foot ring or a pedestal type foot , do you think it is all as made ??

As to how much made its way to the UK from Venice in the 16th and 17th centuries the answer is vast quantities, Venice being until the late 17thc the powerhouse of glass production and there are records of the Glass Sellers Company ordering and importing huge amounts in the 17th c ,of course with the perfection of lead glass in the late 17thc all changed and Venetian glass production went into decline.

You obviously sneaked that one out of the fair before I had the chance to have a good look around , well done , and if you like pop it in a box and I will be able to give a more accurate opinion as to exactly what you have .

Cheers ,

Peter.

Offline brucebanner

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2017, 11:12:32 AM »
Yes the base looks OK with a pontil mark and lots of base wear, the ones in the book are also the same, I wonder if it would be ok to put a pick on from the book or would it be a copy right problem?
Chris Parry

Offline brucebanner

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2017, 03:12:41 PM »
Here are some picks of the base plus the book image.

[Mod: book image removed as image copyright could be compromised.. The book and page no. as stated in an earlier post is now also noted below.]

Book image can be seen on page 110, Murano Island of Glass, by Attilia Dorigato.

Chris Parry

Offline oldglassman

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2017, 03:48:52 PM »
Hi ,
           Base looks fine and a good match to the book image , which book is it ?

cheers ,

Peter.

Offline glassobsessed

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2017, 09:45:00 AM »
How would the base be different if it was made 200 years later?


Offline oldglassman

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Re: 17th century Italian jug for show.
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2017, 09:52:10 AM »
Hi ,
             My comment on the base was in regard to condition , some of these have applied foot rims which over time have been lost or damaged , some were made without feet , this looks to be one of those.

cheers ,

Peter.

edited to add ,    similar item, a Nassa for Etherial oils dated to the late 17th c and probably Northern Italy or Low Countries, the OP's item to my eye has very similar metal , fairly course with bubbles and imperfections , I would be very interested to view any later renditions of these particular forms.

 

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