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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Scandinavian Glass => Topic started by: svazzo on January 06, 2005, 01:11:20 AM

Title: Scandinavian = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 06, 2005, 01:11:20 AM
Hello!
Does anyone know who the maker of this bowl is?
It has the look of a Cenedese piece, but could be Scandinavian. Since I am not that well versed in the Scandinavian glass, maybe one of you can help me decide where it belongs?
Here are 2 pics:

(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/squiggles1.jpg.w300h203.jpg)

(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/squiggles2.jpg.w300h225.jpg)

Thanks for looking!
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Frank on January 24, 2005, 09:47:52 AM
German?
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 28, 2005, 07:08:39 AM
Frank...
What makes you think it is German art glass? or is that just a guess?

Thanks!
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 28, 2005, 07:30:45 AM
About this being Murano, my thought ways the decoration, which looks like something Cenedese or Nason would make, and the piece has a very nicely polished bottom with an inverted (round) pontil mark.

(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/squiggles3.jpg)

I do not know if any other makers leave that inverted pontil like that.
At least I havent come across any other that have it, not even my Scandinavian pieces I've had before.
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Frank on January 28, 2005, 09:20:55 AM
Hi,

German was just a feeling probably because of the colours.

I suppose WMF could be a contender.

Frank
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Ivo on January 28, 2005, 11:24:02 AM
not WMF but could be Maastricht design by Max Verboeket. Unable to confirm, though - the bottom finish is right, sig is not always present on smaller pieces.
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 28, 2005, 06:00:04 PM

I'm trying to find is my thought is correct, that the mark would denote it being an Italian piece.
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 28, 2005, 06:01:50 PM
Quote from: "Ivo"
not WMF but could be Maastricht design by Max Verboeket. Unable to confirm, though - the bottom finish is right, sig is not always present on smaller pieces.


Hi Ivo,
Would Maastricht be German like Frank mentioned it coud be?

Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Frank on January 28, 2005, 06:26:34 PM
Maastricht is in Holland. Continuing the European tour :)

My guess on Germany was based on the two colours used which are very popular colours in Bavaria and whenever I see tourists wearing those colours I guess, usually correctly, that they are German. Of course it is a leap of imagination to apply that to glass....

Polished out pontils are quite common when a good quality finish is desired.  Or where the base is visible through the glass. Glassmakers that usually left the pontil on on opaque glass have been known to grind down and polish, even on Monart! It was not that long ago when any glass without a polished pontil was considered second rate by collectors.
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: taylog1 on January 28, 2005, 08:58:44 PM
Do you think this looks similar ?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v397/taylog1/2705a.jpg)

Listed on the Swedish message board Antikprat last year.

The response was:

onsdag den 04 augusti 2004 - 23.27
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hej!
Jag har en vas var det ser ut som dekoren ligger i glaset. Är det någon som som vet vem som kan vara upphovsman till denna? Tack på förhand!
Bengt

 
Bay Åkerblom
 torsdag den 05 augusti 2004 - 09.23
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Vasen är inte tillverkad i arielteknik!

Den är formgiven av Tora Pors som var knuten till Kalmar glasbruk under åren 1947 till 1954. Hon arbetade oftast själv i hyttan och teknade med färgade glasstavar direkt på
det varma glaset, posten, och när motivet var klart lade man på ett nytt klarglas lager ovanpå dekoren. Dekoren kommer då att ligga ingjuten i glaset. Stilen kallades för
"Myrica" glas och är uppkallad efter henne. Tekniken kallas för "glavering" efter dess upphovsman Arnold Glave.
 

Now I speak no Swedish, so would be interested in the translation.

PS:

Having just done a Google on Arlond Glave I came up with this:
http://www.bokhans.com/glasvas.html



Taylog1
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Sklounion on January 28, 2005, 09:19:59 PM
Rough translation only.....
The vase is probably fabrication from Kalmar glasbruk and designer  Tora Pos, worked Kalmar glasbruk 1947 to 1954. She was working often herself in studio and using a technique with coloured glass powder direct on to the heated glass , working so that the colour is infused. Pattern of vase called "myrica" after a friend. Technique is known as glavering after its creator Arnold Glave.
Marcus
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: tmaritta on January 28, 2005, 09:47:01 PM
I would just add that after the colour decoration was added,  a new clear glass coat was administered.
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 28, 2005, 10:08:17 PM
Quote from: "taylog1"
Do you think this looks similar ?


Hello Taylog1,
I have to say that vase looks very similar to my bowl.
Can you give me the link to that Swedish message board?
I would be interested to know if there are more samples of the Artist!  

Do you know, or would anyone know if the technique used causes tiny bubbles in the powder colors? I mention this because if the reaction is the same it could be by this artist, Tora Pos, and the same technique before mentioned!
 
Here's a close up!
(http://www.svazzo.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/squigclose.jpg)

Wow, I might be close to finding out who it is by! I'm really surprised that it could be that old. My guess would have been 60's. Thank you all for this new information!
.... and translation Marcus!  :wink:

Oh and tmaritta... Do you know much about the artist or technique?
Any info is greatly appreciated!
Thanks
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Anonymous on January 29, 2005, 09:36:18 AM
http://www.antikviteter.net/antikprat/

select <glas>, then <KonstGlas>.

All in swedish

Regards

Taylog1
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 06:16:39 PM
Hi Taylog1,
Thanks for the link! I couldnt understand anything when I logged on but I did manage to send an email, I think?  :?
Guess I'll find out soon.... I emailed the moderator? maybe ot was the moderator, lol, and let him know in English about the piece. Hopefully I wasnt rude by writting in English and someone can translate it for them. I did see 2 posts that were done in English, but they had no replies.

Tried to do a search for "Tora Pos," but didnt get anything that I could read. I'll try searching for "Kalmar glasbruk"

Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Frank on January 29, 2005, 06:33:21 PM
The bubbles are likely to be caused by imprities in the ground enamels either from careless storage/use or even intentional. It is fairly common in cased enamel coloured hand blown shaped glass. But Adam (aa) can probably give even more reasons...
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 06:53:47 PM
Hi Frank!
I was just wondering if it was done on purpose, and if it was part of this particular technique. I've seen something similar with Seguso's "Pulveri" pieces, but there you can actually see the powders and no bubbles. In this piece you see mostly the colors not the powder particles.... I know, I know its another technical question, lol, but as an artist myself, I'm interested in all that stuff  :D

I do want this talk to be more about the Artist than the techniques.
At 1 point I wanted to sell it, but now I would actually like to see more of the artist and maybe collect it!  
Thanks!
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Anonymous on January 29, 2005, 08:26:47 PM
Svazzo's bowl looks a lot heavier and thicker than Taylog's vase.  Dunno, but the bowl looks Italian to me, and Cenedese is a very good guess.  Javier, is it finely made like Scandinavian, or more lumpy and irregular like Murano glass?

I have a feeling that this is a piece that might never get a definative attribution. In any case, I really like both pieces posted, so if not knowing who made them is driving you crazy, feel free to send them here.

Laura
http://planetglass.net/
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 08:49:57 PM
Hi Laura,
Glad to have you on this topic!
The piece is very thick and heavy for its size. It measures 6" long.
Have you handled anything similar in the past?
Any experience with Tora Pos?
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Anonymous on January 29, 2005, 08:58:16 PM
Hi Javier,

It's as much the shape as anything that makes me think it might be Italian.

However, both of the other items shown are remarkably similar in their internal decoration. It's too bad you can't find a piece in person to compare your bowl to. Sometimes comparing the "feel" of the glass of different items can give a lot of clues.

I am not familiar with the Scandi maker, but it certainly bears looking into. Perhaps there is an active factory somewhere who you can ask? Or a collector of these items?  Let us know if your query to the Scandi website yields any results.

Laura
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: tmaritta on January 29, 2005, 09:19:46 PM
Quote from: "svazzo"
Hi Frank!
I was just wondering if it was done on purpose, and if it was part of this particular technique. I've seen something similar with Seguso's "Pulveri" pieces, but there you can actually see the powders and no bubbles. In this piece you see mostly the colors not the powder particles.... I know, I know its another technical question, lol, but as an artist myself, I'm interested in all that stuff  :D

I do want this talk to be more about the Artist than the techniques.
At 1 point I wanted to sell it, but now I would actually like to see more of the artist and maybe collect it!  
Thanks!
Javier


Well, actually the swedish description does not mention powder, but speaks about colorful glass treads or sticks (glasstavar, whereas powder is pulver in swedish) that were applied to the clear glass.  However, my swedish is very rusty and I only have online dictionary for help.  So I don't know if that makes any sense?
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 09:23:34 PM
Hi again Laura,
I still have that gut feeling that says this piece is Italian, but the Vase posted by taylog1 looks very similar.

It would be increadible if I could have the 2 pieces side by side and inspect the decoration and the actual color of the glass. I know it is very hard to know for sure in pictures, but the vase posted has an orangy-pink tint, and my bowl has more of a clear smoky feel. Just to mention it, since we all know artists play aound with colors all the time.
Also noticed a difference in the decoration itself. It looks like the vase has both yellow and orange swirls ovelaping, where in my bowl the 2 colors are purposely separate.

The Vase (link) that Peter posted has a wildly abstracted decoration, where mine has , I would say a more "controlled" abstraction, if that makes sence...

Javier

P.S.
Laura! Cant believe you won the Toso Swirl vase for $1.
Where you distracting me??? :lol:  :wink:
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Frank on January 29, 2005, 09:51:58 PM
I think glass sticks? is right for Javiers vase. I had been looking at the close-up and the lining would certainly make powder unlikely.

It would probably have had some marvering which is a commonly leads to picking up frit but that tends to show up more as specks. Also the variations in the type of glass can lead to bubbling when casing. That they are so fine on your piece is an indication of the glassmakers skill.
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 09:59:42 PM
Thank you for that information Frank!

The little bubbled effect is only on the Blue color, the Purple doesnt have it.
I also tried to take a photo as close as possible and where it was more prevalent. I am really glad to hear you say the piece was done by a very skilled glassmaker!
Thanks again!
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: Anonymous on January 29, 2005, 10:29:16 PM
Hi Javier,

Yes, I was only here to distract you from the Fratelli Toso vase.  :twisted:

Just kidding. Actually, the vase (a cased piece with external swirls of color) is not my favorite. But, for a dollar, I just couldn't pass it up!  Javier, where you tracking it, or just keeping tabs on my recent purchases.  :wink:  If you were checking up on me, did you see the two early Fratelli Toso vases I bought a few weeks ago? Those are fab!

I have been unable to log into ebay today, and had to use esnipe to win the vase. Is anyone else having ebay problems?

Laura
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on January 29, 2005, 10:40:16 PM
Hi Laura.
I was trakcing it. I'll email you bout it.
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: svazzo on February 01, 2005, 03:58:46 AM
Hi again Everyone!
I have a bit of news, although not much....
I contacted Hans Björkman, who posted the Tora Pos vase on the web (link above - page 2), and actually got a response!!! Thank you Hans!

He told me that he doesn't know much English or about glass, but that he was going to contact (forward my email) to a friend of his that knows more. Apparently this person is an authority on Swedish glass, but Hans doesn't know if he speaks English. :(

Basically if I get a response it will be in Swedish, or he won't know what I wrote to him. It all rests on a translation... I knew I should have taken more language classes at school!!!!
Hopefully he will respond! :D

Javier
Title: Tora Pors!
Post by: svazzo on February 04, 2005, 09:43:04 AM
The Winner is?????   :!: taylog1 :!:

Excellent news! I was just contacted by Hans' friend and he tells me that the bowl I have is in fact by Tora Pors!

This was the response:
"Your bowl is designed by Tora Pors and made i Kalmar glass factory around 1950.
She was designer for this factory around this year 1947 – 1954. The stile of this glasses was called ”MYRICA”."

I am so happy for all the help, and the interest taken in the post! Thank you for all the messages. Also to the help of taylog1 for finding that 1st photo, and to Hans and Börje who confirmed it! Can't thank them enough for going out of their way to offer their help!

This gives me hope for my other 2 mystery pieces floating around here, lol.  :D 
Thanks!
Javier
Title: CENEDESE or Scandinavian??? = Tora Pors, i Kalmar
Post by: aa on February 09, 2005, 10:06:59 PM
http://www.tfaoi.com/aa/4aa/4aa204.htm
http://www.trocadero.com/toobiltd/items/86788/item86788store.html#item

The links show work by Richard Jolley using a similar technique. I used this myself with very different results, in the late eighties and early nineties.

The decoration is done by drawing fine single colour canes which are about 3-4mm diameter. You then use these to “draw” on the surface of the glass by using a propane or oxy-propane torch to melt the tip of the cane onto the surface. You do risk burning yourself! Richard Jolley and William Bernstein in the US became the major masters doing this sort of work.

The tiny bubbles on the piece you’ve been researching could have been the result of a number of reasons:

-the canes may not have been marvered into the surface completely, before casing with clear glass
- similarly there may have been some fine particles of glass powder on the marver.
- alternatively it may be that the coloured canes were actually drawn from clear glass coated with powdered colour rather than drawing them from solid colour rods. One might assume this if there is a noticeable variation of colour running along the length of the cane, but it is one of those things that after the event is very difficult to judge.

I’ve never heard them referred to as sticks. We call them canes, which will probably offend the paperweight devotees,  :) but in fact the technique is similar to lampwork. Some people call them threads as can be seen in the first link.