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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Unresolved Glass Queries => Topic started by: thomasandkatherine on October 31, 2005, 05:55:01 AM

Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: thomasandkatherine on October 31, 2005, 05:55:01 AM
I have a uranium stump lady and bowl listed currently on Ebay under number 7361986430.  I have had a query regarding the date of manufacture.  I have always been interested in getting an ID for this particular piece and now is a good time to raise it with the Board.  Is there anyone out there who may know the manufacturer and approximate date of manufacture of the piece.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7361986430&sspagename=ADME:B:AAQ:AU:1

Mod: Replacement pics requested.
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Tigerchips on October 31, 2005, 08:08:14 AM
I think it might be Sowerby. I often see them on eBay described as such (not that that is anything to go by).

There is currently a pink one in one of my charity shops for £6 with bowl. I resisted buying it because the figure has a chip in it and I don't think the bowl matches the figure.
Title: Sowerby
Post by: thomasandkatherine on October 31, 2005, 08:24:35 AM
Hi, the Sowerby piece has the same subject matter but is larger.  She is generally seen with a bowl with large cabbage roses on the base or another bowl with interconnecting starbursts.  This piece is different and I believe is Czech but that is all I know.

By the way, what sort of bowl does your lady in the charity shop come with????
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Tigerchips on October 31, 2005, 08:39:58 AM
I've forgotton what the pink bowl looks like but if the bowl is still there today I will take a picture.  :)

The pink figure in the shop seems to have a mould line running right through the centre.
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Tigerchips on October 31, 2005, 09:49:47 PM
Here are some pictures of the glass lady in my local second hand shop:
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10011/Picture%20736.jpg
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10011/Picture%20735.jpg
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10011/Picture%20737.jpg
Title: Pics
Post by: thomasandkatherine on October 31, 2005, 10:52:33 PM
The lady in the photos is the Sowerby piece.  The bowl is original, I believe.  It is the bowl I described with interconnecting starbursts on the base.  These sets generally sell for around GBP10 to GBP15 on Ebay and a lot more in Australia.  If I saw one of these in a second hand shop in Australia for $15 (rough equivalent of GBP6) I would be taking it home with me pronto.

You can probably see the difference between the pink and uranium figures.  I have attached a link to another photo of my figure so a better comparison can be made.

http://www.glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?album=24&pos=4
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Anonymous on November 01, 2005, 12:33:36 AM
The lady looks genuine to me - the stump is actually a pedestal that also acts as the flower frog, I have found that earlier bowls with central figures seem to be in two pieces, later on you get three pieces (bowl, frog, figurine) for e.g. Inwald's 'Poisson Volant' anyone any idea why that is?

Here
http://www.black-poppy.co.uk/mc/czech/list.htm
Top right hand corner 1930s two piece version

http://www.pressglas-pavillon.de/
Top right hand corner what I believe is version made post war up to 1960s

I have both versions and from the base ware and scratching I have concluded the blue one on the Black Poppy site like my own is 1930s, the amber three piece version is so clean and new looking

The eBay item is in two pieces which is a good indication
I believe it is by 'Cambridge Glass' USA - take a look at the below link, the ridged pedestal is typical of their work

http://www.black-poppy.co.uk/sold/cambridge/list.htm

On the same site is the exact same model of figure as one being sold on eBay http://www.black-poppy.co.uk/sold/cambridge/me17.jpg small green, it does not have the ridged or gadrooned pedestal/frog but they did smooth versions as well, the point is the shape is an exact match and you can see looking through the different pages on Black Poppy that the base is very ‘Cambridge’

As to the bowl, there would have been different shapes, and although it is not shown on Black Poppy site, I am sure it is original and Cambridge as well

I do think the price asked is a bit steep, but that is just my opinion, I am sure Black Poppy would be pleased to advise you
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Anonymous on November 01, 2005, 12:39:48 AM
Ref above post - link is to website to get picture I am talking about click on 'Markhbienn'

http://www.pressglas-pavillon.de/
Top right hand corner what I believe is version made post war up to 1960s
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: thomasandkatherine on November 01, 2005, 03:15:51 AM
Hi, similar in style as are all of three of the stump figures but not the same and far finer in detail and workmanship.  It is not Cambridge...the Cambridge figure is also known as "Bashful Charlotte" or the "Draped Lady" - moulds were sold to Imperial and later produced as figurines etc I believe.

I am almost certain that my piece is Czech but would still be grateful for an ID
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: thomasandkatherine on November 01, 2005, 03:21:07 AM
I forgot to say, the Cambridge figures do not have a ridged base as mentioned.  I have owned a couple. The ribbed appearance is, in fact, the flower holes in silhouette.  Also, I have sold two of three of the uranium pieces before and have good experience of the price they fetch on the Ebay market.
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Anonymous on November 01, 2005, 05:48:36 AM
Hi Alison,

I agree, not Cambridge. I think all the Cambridge are here:

http://www.cambridgeglass.org/memberphotos/picfrogs.htm

They are beautifully detailed - Cambridge isn't called elegant for nothing.

Is there any chance of a better picture, showing some different angles? Maybe use a back sheet and a flood light to bring the details out.

Re Sowerby, see the bottom page, from 1956 catalogue.

http://www.bullworks.net/ffg/engpg/pgrod/pgrod.html


As for the price - it's probably about right for the Australian market. (The price is set by antiques shops and includes an importation cost!)

Cathy B.
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Cathy B on November 01, 2005, 05:49:48 AM
The last guest was genuinely me. Who was the other guest?

Cathy
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: thomasandkatherine on November 01, 2005, 06:17:47 AM
Hello Cathy.  As for the penultimate guest, I cannot say.  Did I sound a little piqued regarding the question of value?  I was!

The Sowerby Lady is definitely different from this lady.  I have several of the Sowerby sets and, in my experience, they sell for significantly less than this uranium set.  She is shown on the Pressglas website as "unknown".  I understand that the Sowerby set was called "Flora" and that it was sold as a promotional item at one stage.  Have you also heard this

People have often quoted the book you refer to.  I have also found that it is very inaccurate, particularly in regard to this piece.

I will endeavour to get some better shots and post them.


Alison
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Tigerchips on November 01, 2005, 10:32:47 AM
I didn't realise how many similar looking lady's there are out there.  :)
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Anonymous on November 01, 2005, 09:09:02 PM
I must apologise to thomasandkatherine, I did not realise it was your item, you were selling - ahhhhh :oops:

I thought as with so many posts it was questioning an eBay listing. I am sure you will get the price asked, as you say - you know your market, I hope you see I was only trying to help

I have to admit I got £100.000 for a lady figurine in frosted uranium glass - it was Czech but had a UK Rd No. which dated and gave it an attribution and UK importer ref the Rd No. It was Inwald I think, I posted it a while back but can't find it now.

You are correct about the ridged bases, I could not edit as a guest, I meant to say that ‘ridged appearance’ to the base or as you have explained stump (I was not meaning to question they are in fact sometimes called stumps, sorry if it sounded like that), which I am sure you will concede also acts as a frog unlike with some other pieces (ref my post), I have some Cambridge and you can feel slight bumps towards the top - the holes are so near the outer edge, I think they also did Scalloped bases to some figures.

Yes you are correct about the moulds being sold on - I cannot see the finishing in your eBay photo and it did look so like the green, in fact many of the ladies, in the Cambridge page at Black Poppy, the one at the back I linked is a dead ringer, but as you mention, Cambridge is very fine with few bubbles and mould lines very fine or ground down

Thing is so many companies either through the selling or passing on of moulds, or copying items with slight changes can make attribution a nightmare

Maybe if you can post a very clear picture of the figure as you state (I am sure the bowl is right still), Czech experts like Marcus will be bale to help

At least I helped by ruling out Cambridge :oops: LOL

I have looked at your eBay pic again and ref http://www.cambridgeglass.org/memberphotos/picfrogs.htm it looks like the ‘Green 8in Draped Lady on candleholder centerpiece’ – wow – I wonder if the Czech copy came after as there is definitely much similarity

It is a real brain teaser, I have pieces I know are Sowerby, Bagley or Jobling – then these really similar figures, centrepieces and mascots that have more bubbles, less fine finishing, when I ask for an attribution I usually get Czech, but only occasionally with a factory
Title: Ebay Item 7361986430 - ID
Post by: Cathy B on November 04, 2005, 06:13:01 AM
Hi there,

The Cambridge draped lady does resemble Alison's, but I think  that Alison's is seated whereas the draped lady is standing, and you can see both knees in Alison's, but not in the Cambridge.

That said, these beasties are devilishly difficult to photograph and it's quite hard to see the detail.

Cathy.