Glass Message Board

Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => USA => Topic started by: Morgan48 on March 09, 2005, 10:49:39 AM

Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Morgan48 on March 09, 2005, 10:49:39 AM
http://tinypic.com/22bznd
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Ivo on March 09, 2005, 12:43:22 PM
fascinating, absolutely riveting. But what IS it?
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: chopin-liszt on March 09, 2005, 01:58:28 PM
I believe it's the bottom of a bottle. Perfectly logical, depending on your perspective! :lol:  :lol:  :lol: Skol, Sue.
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Morgan48 on March 09, 2005, 03:14:14 PM
Apologies for that....I logged in in order to test the links I was quoting regarding Tinypic and was then going to delete it........but I couldn't find a delete facility.
Anyway its the bottom view of what I understand to be a Northwood bowl...except on the site that I was reccomended to go to I couldn't find the colour. My reason for buying it ( via USA Ebay ) is that the dimensions of the foot and the overall appearanve , except the rim are virtually identical to a Davidsons No21 ( ???sure...??? ) bowl. The colouring also predates one of the Davidsons orange variations by approx10 years.
And also on the Northwood site I finally after 20 years found out why the black bases with 3 feet sometimes did not fit to any of the Davidsons pieces...because Northwood were producing them.
Thats the reason for the photo BUT while its on here now....can any please provide me with some dates regarding Northwood/orange glass.

Regards and thanks

Gareth


Morgan48
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Ivo on March 09, 2005, 07:19:54 PM
I had the same question a few months ago about the same bowl in light blue - and it turned out to be Cambridge, not Northwood. They ran an almost identical production, with slight differences in colour. The year for the "azurite" blue one would be ca. 1922, but I was led to believe that true orange glass is something that doesn't occur before the thirties?

the ID came from a well documented US collector - I do not think we can be expected to have this type of documentation available, and it may not be online anywhere.
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: glasswizard on March 09, 2005, 08:59:15 PM
Gareth to help you out. If this is northwood, the color is called Chinese Coral. It was introduced in 1924 and since the company closed in 1925 it did not have a long run. The variation of color can be tremendous from a deep red to an orange. This period can be confusing because Northwood, Cambridge and Fenton all made similiar products. Cambridge did not make an opaque red or orange. Fenton did however. Fentons color is called Mandarin red and was produced 1933-1935. Hope this helps, Terry in Iowa
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Connie on March 09, 2005, 10:53:42 PM
I would also like to see a picture of the entire piece.  I think I have an identical bowl

It was sold to me as Fenton and for a while I thought it was Fenton Flame.  However, I have since come to believe mine is actually made by Diamond Glass in "flame" as picture on page 114 in "Dugan/Diamond - The Story of Indiana, Pennsylvania Glass" by Heacock, Measell, and Wiggins.

It is definitely not Fenton Mandarin Red or Venetian  Red which happens to be my collecting passion  8)  Northwood Chinese Coral is very similar to Fenton Mandarin Red so I don't believe it is Northwood either.
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Morgan48 on March 10, 2005, 01:48:48 PM
Right...a couple more photographs.

The one looking down into the bowl is rather boring as the orange markings are only underneath

The profile is sitting most snuggly on a Davidsons No4 base.

Does this help at all please in identity.


http://tinypic.com/22kmex

http://tinypic.com/22kml0


Regards


Gareth


Morgan48
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Ivo on March 10, 2005, 07:34:57 PM
its as i thought i have the same one in blue but no base.
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Anonymous on March 10, 2005, 11:15:11 PM
The pictures of the entire piece changed my mind  :lol:

If it is as red as it appears in the second pictures with the orange confined to the bottom or slightly swirled in the red near the bottom, then I concur that it is most likely Northwood Chinese Coral.

My bowl is packed away right now while our house is being renovated but I will post a picture of it when it is unpacked.  It is much more orange overall with hints of yellow swirled in it.
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Morgan48 on March 12, 2005, 10:09:25 AM
Quote from: "Anonymous"
The pictures of the entire piece changed my mind  :lol:

If it is as red as it appears in the second pictures with the orange confined to the bottom or slightly swirled in the red near the bottom, then I concur that it is most likely Northwood Chinese Coral.


Hi Connie

Is there a link to a website please that attributes this colour to Northwood. I visited one late last year that had many shapes of bowls etc ( including this one?? ) but no mention at all regarding this as a colour of theirs.
With the other possibilities mentioned earlier in this thread I'm still somewhat confused ( easy for me )..... can you add any more to this please
The colour is more or less accurate and this piece has a real tomato soup looking colour ...ie orange  bordering on to red


Regards


Gareth


Morgan48
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Connie on March 12, 2005, 11:44:06 AM
Hi Gareth -

I don't know of a collector's or reference website for the opaque glass made by Northwood.  The popularity of their carnival glass far outpaces their other production.  But maybe Glen will know of a site

I did find 2 pieces for sale on the web -

 Deep Cupped Bowl (http://www.trocadero.com/longbrook/items/351937/item351937.html) and a  Chinese Coral bowl with a black attached foot.  (http://www.trocadero.com/halfbookglass/items/273757/item273757.html)

I looked in my reference books (Colors in Cambridge Glass) and confirmed that Cambridge did not make an orange-red opaque glass.

As to it being Fenton, again the Fenton Mandarin Red looks very similar in overall color until you compare the secondary color swirled in it.  While Northwood Chinese Coral is red with orange swirls, Fenton Mandarin red is red with a darker red swirled in it. It is easy to confuse the 2 colors unless you have 1 of each in front of you. I have some pieces which I know absolutely to be Fenton Mandarin Red because of the mould - Big Cookies Jar and a Big Cookies Basket.  No other company made pieces remotely similar to these.  I also have a Northwood Chinese Coral candlestick (which again is packed away) :(  So from your pictures I would say this is not Fenton Mandarin Red.

Now to further complicate things, I revisited the Dugan/Diamond book I had cited previously and found another bowl that they identify as being by Diamond and similar to Northwood's Chinese Coral color.  They go on to say others are similar to Fenton Flame (my first guess on your bowl before I saw your other pictures). Apparently Diamond was having problems with consistency in color.

Some of the glass artists here can probably explain this better than I, but these red colors are extremely heat sensitive and hard to produce consistently. The color differeniation seen in Fenton Mandarin Red is achieved by leaving an old gather on the punty rod then getting a new gather, so they had glass that had been heated once (which in Fenton's case is the darker color) then the overall red which was the new gather.

Here is an example of Fenton Mandarin Red  (http://www.justglassmall.com/stores/leebroad/items/269286/item269286justglass.html) which shows the color variation fairly accurately.

Almost all the better known American glassmakers of the 1920s-30s were making these rolled rim or cupped bowls.  But from the color, I would say it was made by either Northwood or Diamond if it is American. To differentiate between the 2 you would have to find bowls from each company and compare the measurements or the details of the foot or collar base.  The problem with the reference books is that most picture these bowls on a stand so that you can't see the details of the foot!
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Glen on March 12, 2005, 12:32:08 PM
There was a similar discussion about an item in stretch glass, I think. The thread was "Blue bowl clue anyone?". I contacted a friend of mine about that discussion - Dave Shetlar (an authority on Stretch) - and he was kind enough to come and make a guest posting in this forum on that Blue bowl thread. His website does have some excellent information on Northwood and other makers. Here's the url for the Northwood Stretch page, there are other links at the bottom right of that page. Dave also has info on that site on other makers.

http://bugs.osu.edu/~bugdoc/Shetlar/StretchGlass/SGCompanies/Northwood/Northwood1.htm

Glen
Title: Tinypic / NORTHWOOD .?? // More Photographs
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2005, 06:05:36 PM
Hi Connie/Glen


Connie
Very many thanks for the excellent information....the colour of the first 2 examples looks very much like mine., and the  Fenton red in fact is quite a different colour altogether. What I find odd is no mention on the Northwood site of the colour....and yet the listing you exampled describes it as Northwood coral. Regarding the base rim there is a very good photograph of one on the Northwood site and I really cannot see any difference in this one to mine. The alternative I suppose is the Diamond company. Anyway its fun finding out as its surprising what else turns up in the process.

Glen

It was this link that was provided before that led me down the Northwood route. I'm sure the bowl is shown on there but not the colours.....and there is a section there just for the colour variations.....however again , many thanks for your response , very much appreciated


Regards to you both


gareth


morgan48