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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Malta Glass => Topic started by: Pip on October 12, 2006, 09:00:14 PM

Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 12, 2006, 09:00:14 PM
Hello, this one's for Sue primarily, what with being the Mdina Maestro, but obviously I'd be delighted for anyone to chip in with info.  

Below are links to two pieces of Mdina - the first one is an Amethyst Trailed vase - what I want to know is, am I right in thinking this is an early colour and as such reasonably desirable?  The second one is unusual (for me anyway since I've not seen one the same before) in that it's frosted white glass with blue trailing with an old looking paper label.  Any idea on dates and desirability on this one also?  Obviously they're both nice but from a collector's point of view I'd be interested because I've hit a very solid brick wall in my research and I'm still very much on a learning curve with Maltese glass.  Thanks mucho in advance.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g60/pips-trip/Mdina-Amethyst0001.jpg

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g60/pips-trip/Mdina-Frosted0001.jpg
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Sklounion on October 12, 2006, 10:07:50 PM
One for Mark Hill????
regards,
Marcus
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 12, 2006, 10:15:05 PM
Quote from: "Le Casson"
One for Mark Hill????
regards,
Marcus


Unfortunately these aren't covered in his new book :-( which I must stress is an excellent reference source on Maltese glass and well worth buying - perhaps I should do a book review on it >>>I'll add that to my long list of 'must-dos'... in the meantime.... any ideas?
Title: Post subject
Post by: vidrioguapo on October 13, 2006, 12:56:13 PM
Is the amethyst one actually marked Mdina?  It bears remarkable similiarities to Whitefriars Pat. No  9802 (6") or 9801 (7")  Random strapped which came in colour Aubergine in 1972!!! Have a look in the W.F catalogues at how similiar they are!!! Emmi
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: David E on October 13, 2006, 01:21:37 PM
I'm sure Sue would be interested so I just nudged her! (electronically, I mean) :lol:
Title: Re: Post subject
Post by: Pip on October 13, 2006, 03:45:10 PM
Quote from: "vidrioguapo"
Is the amethyst one actually marked Mdina?  It bears remarkable similiarities to Whitefriars Pat. No  9802 (6") or 9801 (7")  Random strapped which came in colour Aubergine in 1972!!! Have a look in the W.F catalogues at how similiar they are!!! Emmi


That's interesting Emmi but it is signed Mdina - I'm thinking it's probably around the same date as the WF one you mention - I wonder if there was an element of copying going on and who was copying who?

Cheers David - I know Sue's a very busy lady but I'm sure she'll catch up with this thread eventually :-)
Title: Post subject
Post by: vidrioguapo on October 13, 2006, 05:22:12 PM
Good job it is marked then....extraordinary how similar it is....no idea who copied who.....got to say I found another Mdina vase not long ago which was very similar to   a Whitefriars studio vase with strapping.  It wasn't signed  Mdina so I hummed and ahrred for ages whether to buy or not to buy....I didn't, so still have no idea what it was.  It was quite dear so didn't want to make an expensive mistake!

I some Mdina unsigned?  Emmi
Title: Re: Post subject
Post by: Pip on October 13, 2006, 05:59:38 PM
Quote from: "vidrioguapo"
Is some Mdina unsigned?  Emmi


Yes quite a lot is unsigned - a lot of the early stuff in particular and for a brief period in the late 60's some pieces also had a polished pontil.
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: David E on October 13, 2006, 06:15:01 PM
I do have two unsigned pieces with random strapping that I've always assumed were Mtarfa. As the two sigs can look similar, I'm wondering if it could be Mtarfa?
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 13, 2006, 06:49:26 PM
Nope, it's most definitely Mdina - see piccie below...

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g60/pips-trip/amethystsig0001.jpg
Title: Post subject
Post by: vidrioguapo on October 13, 2006, 07:26:43 PM
As a matter of interest, what are the dimensions of this piece?  Emmi
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 13, 2006, 07:37:17 PM
Sure, it's 7.5in tall and 3in diameter.
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 14, 2006, 10:35:39 AM
:D

The first piece is definitely Mdina, post Harris, as it is marked, but soon after. The colouring is very good, with shades of yellows under the amethyst. I don't understand how it could be confused with Whitefriars! The second is a good bit later, but still Mdina. I don't know when frosting came in, and I avoid frosted bits if I can. Just my personal taste, I loathe it.

If you get your sticky little mitts on Mark's book - a fantastic read, you'll find out the real story behind "who copied who" as far as the bark textured things are concerned, as this was actually not the case at all, it was more of a collaberation of two fascinated and enthusiastic artists at Whitefriars and Mdina, discussing new ideas together. The credit for the origin of bark textured pieces in the 20th century should probably really go to Timo Sarpaneva.
Title: Post subject
Post by: vidrioguapo on October 14, 2006, 10:41:29 AM
Quote
It bears remarkable similiarities to Whitefriars ....


Only said "similar"....in any event thought the yellow was reflection from something else.....and you can't deny it is similar!!!   Lovely glass to which I am always attracted but don't collect!  Emmi
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 14, 2006, 10:59:48 AM
:D :D :D

Please don't take any offence, {{{Emmi}}}, if it sounded that way, it had just come out wrongly!

I have to confess a love of certain Whitefriars myself, but can't afford a Peter Wheeler "Peacock" vase! But I do have a strapped amethyst vase!
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: josordoni on October 14, 2006, 11:03:33 AM
Sue, while you are around, could you have a look at a Lollipop listing of mine and let me know if you think it is Mdina (as I do I think) or Isle of Wight?

Lollipop vase (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=230037617831&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT)  

Thanks,
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 14, 2006, 12:16:30 PM
Quote from: "chopin-liszt"
:D

The first piece is definitely Mdina, post Harris, as it is marked, but soon after. The colouring is very good, with shades of yellows under the amethyst. I don't understand how it could be confused with Whitefriars! The second is a good bit later, but still Mdina. I don't know when frosting came in, and I avoid frosted bits if I can. Just my personal taste, I loathe it.

If you get your sticky little mitts on Mark's book - a fantastic read, you'll find out the real story behind "who copied who" as far as the bark textured things are concerned, as this was actually not the case at all, it was more of a collaberation of two fascinated and enthusiastic artists at Whitefriars and Mdina, discussing new ideas together. The credit for the origin of bark textured pieces in the 20th century should probably really go to Timo Sarpaneva.


Thanks Sue - most helpful - so I was right in thinking that the amethyst is probably early 1970's.   The frosted one has quite an old (yellowed) paper label on it but I think they carried on using that label until the late 1980's so from what you've said and the state of the label I'm thinking it's 80's.  I know what you mean about the frosting - I must admit it's not my favourite type of Mdina however it was going for pennies and I do love a bargain especially if it's labelled :-)  By the way, I have Mark's book but I've only devoured the photographs so far I've not actually read it  :oops:
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 18, 2006, 10:31:19 AM
:D 8) :D

So Pip, you'll know that Lynne's vase is Mdina!

DO read the book - it's absolutely fascinating about the glass itself, particularly about how the colours were achieved, and it's a fantastic story about the whole family and their involvement.
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: josordoni on October 18, 2006, 10:37:08 AM
Hurray!  I know it might be Boo!  that it isn't Isle of Wight, but to be honest I DID think it was a long shot, and now I know for certain.

Many thanks Sue!

Is this colourway fairly early?

Pip, what does the book say?  I really should have bought it at the fair.  Silly me.
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: Pip on October 18, 2006, 12:17:40 PM
Rightey oh Lynne - well, the book says this is a Lollipop vase (not a fish vase which is a sort of squarer shape) designed by Michael Harris and produced from the mid 1970's until the 1990's - since yours isn't signed that would indicate an earlier rather than later piece.  The book gives a price estimate on one a quarter of an inch smaller than yours at £50-£70. Hope that helps.
Title: Dating Mdina....
Post by: josordoni on October 18, 2006, 12:32:04 PM
Thank you Pip!  I'm relisting it tonight anyway, so I've changed the description around to reflect what my new corrected attribution - and I would LOVE to get that much for it, but somehow I think it might be a bit on the high side for ebay...but you never know.  I'm popping it in the shop for a bit, so I can put the price up with a Best Offer and who knows?