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Glass Discussion & Research. No ID requests here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: adam20 on September 20, 2012, 03:47:07 PM

Title: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 20, 2012, 03:47:07 PM
Just bought a Caithness vase. At first I thought it was Xanadu but getting home to mark Hill's book I see they never made this shape in that range - page 35 shows a vase same design as this same hieght and with that polished rim, says post Xanadu, trial range only sold in factory shops. This has the blue Caithness sticker but more interesting is the white bar code on the base which looks as if it were a shop piece, unless it is for the factory shop. What do others think - its a beautiful and heavy vase and I got it for a snip.


Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: chopin-liszt on September 20, 2012, 05:21:55 PM
I've certainly seen this design, it's lovely and rather more sophisticated than Xanadu!
It's cased, which Xanadu isn't, and the colours are more subtle. It is later.
What's bothering me is I can't remember if the bits I've seen have purple bottoms. I'm positive Christine's got one - and she's got the book, I'm sure she will be able to elaborate a little more than I can.

Superb piece, well done! ;D
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Lustrousstone on September 20, 2012, 06:38:05 PM
Mine (now with Ivo) was a bowl
http://lustrousstone.co.uk/cpg/displayimage.php?pid=896
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 20, 2012, 09:04:47 PM
Thanks. Interesting to see the bowl. This would suggest it was a definite range? To add to the confusion, Millers Collectables 2010-11 calls it Xanadu, which as already said I don't think these are. I think they are lovely and not that often seen and similar, but .... It would be great to find out more.

Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: nigel benson on September 21, 2012, 12:43:36 AM
Would checking the lender, and/or editor credits for that issue of Miller's help at all??

Nigel
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Lustrousstone on September 21, 2012, 06:34:50 AM
It's not Xanadu.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: glassobsessed on September 21, 2012, 08:47:50 AM
Agree with Christine this is not Xanadu.

Xanadu not cased Sue? There are several layers of glass, it is quite a complex design. Here is a photo of a bit of Xanadu for reference along with a shot of the base where the various layers can be seen (however they were built up).

John
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 21, 2012, 08:53:43 AM
I have a bit of Xanadu (hexaganol) same colourway John. I agree that this is not Xanadu. Just shows that despite publications there is still research to be done. I am sure this was a range sold to shops. That is a shop label to base. I might try and contact Mark Hill direct or can anyone suggest an ex Caithness employee on this board?

Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: chopin-liszt on September 21, 2012, 10:14:43 AM
I meant Xanadu is not cased in clear glass - it has a surface texture too.
I'm looking at my orange and brown triangular one right now. The strapping is shiney and stands slightly proud of the textured orange background.

This newer and more sophisticated design is definitely a range. Most often seen with clear plastic labels.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 21, 2012, 10:20:15 AM
Yes Sue. Mine has plastic label. Seen in Mark Hill's book as 2000s So it is post Xanadu as Mark points out. It is deffinately inspired by it and yes it has a heavy glass casing, in fact the walls are very thick, over 1cm.

Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: chopin-liszt on September 21, 2012, 10:23:55 AM
No doubt the range name will be found eventually.
A super piece to have, named or not. :)
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Lustrousstone on September 21, 2012, 11:23:06 AM
These aren't cased in clear either. The surface is textured
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 21, 2012, 11:28:57 AM
There is a white layer sandwiched between two thick clear layers, the outer decoration is applied which gives a texture like feel.

Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: chopin-liszt on September 21, 2012, 11:35:10 AM
 :-[
Sorry, I was wrong then, thanks for the correction! :-*
 :( I don't have one.....
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: adam20 on September 24, 2012, 09:43:24 AM
Just for reference here is my Xanadu vase

Adam
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: MarkHill on September 24, 2012, 10:46:12 AM
Hi,
Okay, yes, this is part of a 'range' that was made in the late 1990s, and was inspired by Xanadu. As my Caithness book says.
I wrote the entry in the Miller's Guide that attributed this to the Xanadu range some years ago. This was based on how the piece shown was made, and what the owner of the piece and I knew about Caithness glass at the time. That was based on experience, and the information we could find online and elsewhere. We were wrong. It wasn't true. New original evidence changed knowledge and information. You know, that happens sometimes in antiques and collecting, particularly in new areas...
So, the information in my Caithness book came from two designers who were at Caithness at the time. They remembered the range clearly, and said that it was 'inspired by' or 'based on' Xanadu. Not many were made. It didn't have a range name, hence my use of inverted commas in the first sentence. They were sold in the factory shops, but maybe they did go elsewhere. Bar codes may have been attached in factory shops. Maybe (this is my personal opinion now...) that one came from a batch of discounted glass sold off when the factory closed, if such a thing ever even existed. Perhaps it was 'old stock' rediscovered in a warehouse and sold in one of those discount shops that you find in Crieff or Stoke-on-Trent? Perhaps it came out of a glass/ceramics distributor. Last year on eBay such a company was selling a large quantity of very good (and not so good) boxed Caithness in the US. Perhaps we will never know...
Best,
Mark
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: glassobsessed on September 24, 2012, 11:31:47 AM
Thank you very much for the clarification Mark.

And here was me thinking that the written word is utterly accurate and reliable. ;)

John
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: MarkHill on September 24, 2012, 11:46:22 AM
Thank you very much for the clarification Mark.

And here was me thinking that the written word is utterly accurate and reliable. ;)

John

Ha. Just consider the best selling book in the history of the world, which is also The Word of God.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Frank on September 24, 2012, 06:40:00 PM
Cannot locate 98 glassware cat at the moment so asked...

Quote from: Alastair MacIntosh
Designed by Phil Chaplain, I think it was called Salome, c.1998.- but not sure.

98 fits with pattern number of 7820
 
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: chopin-liszt on September 24, 2012, 06:52:34 PM
"Salome" is a blue exterior with a green inner layer and has iridescent  "feather" pulls up the sides, Frank.
I've got one and it's gorgeous!

I'm also a bit surprised to find out the piece in question here is not a named range, I've seen a fair bit of it around and know a few folk with bits.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: glassobsessed on November 24, 2012, 03:16:16 PM
There is a green and blue variation too.

John
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Wuff on November 24, 2012, 11:18:01 PM
I only have a few artglass catalogues (paperweights being my main topic) and a few price lists (not necessarily same years).

Haven't found the vase and/or bowl in any of my catalogues - so, without image, I cannot be sure ... but

I have found code 7820 in the 1999 price list: "Horizon" Teardrop Vase: the shape (teardrop) fits - so if anyone in possession of the 1999 catalogue could check, we may have tracked it down.

The range also includes
7821 Bud Vase, and
7822 Round Bowl - which would fit images shown in this thread.

Height of the Teardrop Vase should be 192 mm, and the diameter of the Round Bowl 144 mm: would these fit your items?

The range is not mentioned in the 1998 price list - don't have art glass info 2000 - but the range is not in the 2001 catalogue - so it seems to have been in production for a short while only.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: glassobsessed on November 24, 2012, 11:26:28 PM
Size is spot on for the bowl and the name Horizon seems to fit the design nicely too.
Title: Re: Caithness Vase - Post Xanadu?
Post by: Lustrousstone on November 25, 2012, 11:21:52 AM
Thanks Wuff. I'll update my website with a ?