Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Unresolved Glass Queries => Topic started by: rbm6167 on September 04, 2005, 08:06:27 PM
-
I recently acquired this most beautiful decanter which is in a rich, gorgeous amber colour. I know nothing about it though I thought it might be Scandinavian by its clean lines and rather geometric look. The base has a sunken, polished pontil (photograph provided). Can anyone help with a more accurate identification, please? It is 9.5 inches tall and has a base diameter of 5 inches.
Thanks
John
http://tinypic.com/ddcoj4.jpg
http://tinypic.com/ddcoso.jpg
-
John, you can post your picture at the Is It Whitefriars section of www.whitefriars.com, and they might be able to help.
Does anyone know any better?
Cathy.
By the way, some years ago I came across some Whitefriars plans for glasses which were proposed to be made for the Australian Parliament House early last century. They were never made because the contract apparently went to someone else - I think it was Webb, but don't quote me.
The drawings looked fairly boring to me, but would it be worth me getting copies for the public domain?
-
My gut instinct was Webb, but only because of the colour and ground pontil: without an acid-etch mark on the base, probably not.
The drawings looked fairly boring to me, but would it be worth me getting copies for the public domain?
Cathy, I'm sure WF collectors would be fascinated by these and placing them into the public domain is an unselfish action that can only be applauded :D
-
Thank you all for your contributions and I shall certainly post the picture on the Whitefriars' website. I will let you know the outcome, for interests sake.
Regards
John
-
Talking of Whitefriars decanters, have a look at this decanter which I just came across.
link (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Whitefriars-Glass-Bell-Decanter-Ideal-for-the-Port-5NR_W0QQitemZ7344424335QQcategoryZ64877QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)
I have one of these and I've always believed it to be a Georgeon Newcastle decanter. :)
-
I was reserving judgement on the amber decanter - I thought the stopper was odd for WF of this era - but I'm most likely wrong, I'm really not at all sure.
The clear glass one Tigerchips just put on...they've just copied the blurb form www.whitefriars.org haven't they? lol It's a nice decanter, but it doesn't say Whitefriars to me...it's just too fiddly! :D
-
Miller's Glass buyers' guide page 77 shows one of the clear ones Tigerchips refers to as c.1840, so very early Victorian, which would still fit the style of the piece. No maker's details in Miller's though. Funnily enough I saw one of these for sale in Oxfam a couple of weeks ago for £20... it wasn't there for very long! (No, I didn't buy it.)
-
Anne, funnily enough, that is where I got my identification from. I never trust Millers though. I just use them occasionally for reference rather than a price guide. I must have more than 27 millers books but I stopped buying them ever since I got the internet.
In one of thier books they said that a certian fish vase was made by Jules Lang.
I tried selling the so called Jules Lang bowl on an antique fair only to be told that it's actually Brockwitz. :oops: :oops: :oops:
I'm having difficulty selling my Newcastle decanter at £20 even though I live near Newcastle. :)
-
Tigerchips, come to Lancaster - it'll sell there at £20 for sure! :)
BTW some of the Miller's books authors are well-respected members of this board. 8)
-
Oh yes, well respected by me too. There is no doubt that I wouldn't know as much about pottery if it wasn't for Miller's. :)
What I think is a bit odd is that they have prices based on auctions and specialists. Surely, if they were to use Internet prices it would be more accurate.
Take a look at the Chance glass hankerchief vases. Priced at £40 in Millers and i'd be lucky to get £5 for it on the net or antique stall.
I think in all honesty, these prices are useless to me. Perhaps if i moved to Lancaster i'd change my mind. :)
As for the mistake, it is the only one I saw after reading 27 volumes 50 times. That's impressive. Perhaps, i was a bit harsh distrusting them in that respect.
Did I mention how EXTREMELY intelligent all of the Miller's authors are? :wink:
I've been reading another link (Century glass) and Glen said that Bockwitz was also being advertised by Jules Lang & Co.
Perhaps Miller was not completely wrong afterall. :)
-
The prices reflect major auction houses rather than internet prices, don't they? Perhaps the internet is having a downward effect on prices of all collectibles, not just glass.
We also shouldn't forget that many of the books pre-date the upsurge in internet use as well. ;)
Also, books are fine as reference but like any source it's subject to correction as new info comes to light. As we say in the genealogy world (where I spend some of my other time) primary sources are everything! 8)
-
I'm sure i just saw rbm6167's decanter in one of Millers books. It had the same shape only it was cut glass made by Webb.
I had to put my book down for a second while I was busy doing something else and when I came back I must have placed it next to the other 27 volumes. I even forgot what colour it was. :oops:
I went through all the books twice but failed to find it again. :roll:
I suppose there are many decanters that look like each other anyway. :)
-
The prices reflect major auction houses rather than internet prices, don't they? Perhaps the internet is having a downward effect on prices of all collectibles, not just glass.
They are auction hammer prices, but I don't think eBay is having a downward effect on prices as such, but it might be accelerating the trends and fashions in glass collecting. Well, the lower priced items anyway :wink:
But due to rapidly fluctuating trends, the prices in Miller's would only be effective from the day the book was compiled. As Tigerchips mentions; they're excellent guides, but the prices should be treated with caution.
:idea: However, what I can't understand is why Miller's or Dorling Kindersley haven't published a price guide on the web that is updated to suit these trends? Simple enough to register ownership of the book and the ability to download new guides, say every quarter, for example...
Also another way to make money, of course, by charging for each download... but would people then buy the next print edition — ah, there's the rub...
-
How strange !
The same decanter has been uploaded by Ronnie Montgomery :shock: at "Is it Whitefriars". :evil:
According to their expert Lyn Webster 8) it's Webb as has been suggested here, :) because of the treacly amber color. :shock:
Thats also funny because I said Whitefriars because I thought how much like their Golden Amber color it looked and how similarly deco in style to Patrick Hogan's pieces linked in the recent repairs thread. http://www.whitefriars.com/my_photo.php?Owner=Patrick+Hogan&Id=1435
As I say this I have sitting on the table in the sunlight a Whitefriars golden amber bud vase pat #9556 and a beaked vase #9566. In both cases where the light stikes the thicker parts of the glass it looks a very deep rich tone and also quite reddish.
Just shows how color is open to interpretation and how difficult it is attributing on color and style alone.
Are there any books on Webbs ?
-
Are there any books on Webbs ?
Thomas Webb? Not that I'm aware of Peter, but do let me know if you find one! 3 pages in 20th Century Factory Glass and odd mentions elsewhere.
If you look at Great Glass there is a mention on this page...
http://www.great-glass.co.uk/glass%20notes/glass.htm
Not allowed to quote verbatim due to copyright, but basically there was going to be a reproduction of a 1938 catalogue on CD (presumed to include the complete range), but I drew a blank after contacting Philip Petrides (Mr. Great Glass).
So apart from one other web site (below) where Webb's glass is mentioned in detail I can't find much at all.
http://www.jdl.co.nz/thoswebb.html
-
Thanks David
Thomas Webb?
From the article you link to, which I seem to remember reading previously, can I assume that sometime after 1835 the companies were effectively merged into one ?
If so then it's only for glass prior to that date which needs to be specified as to which Webb ?
I hope so then I don't have to worry about it. Extremely unlikely I shall ever own any glass that old !
-
From the article you link to, which I seem to remember reading previously, can I assume that sometime after 1835 the companies were effectively merged into one ?
Not that I'm aware. I think there are three totally seperate entities named 'Webb' operating in the last century, according to Ivo's book; Thomas Webb, Webb Corbett and Webbs' Crystal.
There were some mergers and take-overs, but mainly lesser-known companies. Most art glass (at least, the stuff I'm interested in) is Thomas Webb.
The web page is also referred to in Frank's 'GLASS MARKS & LABELS' "sticky" topic:
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,831.0.html
-
There is no sign of any mark at all, not even a faint or partial mark. I have been caught out before with an extremely faint mark on a sunshine amber bullet vase by Webb so I paid particular attention.
The decanter uploaded on Whitefriars is the same one as this as advised by the first respondent - I used my friend Ronnie's Whitefriars username as I am not registered - just to add to the confusion!
Regards
John
-
Hi John,
This doesn't rule out it being Webb, but does cast some doubt. The colour is very similar to that used in the 1930-60s for the vast majority of their 'Bullseye' range and Webb always ground and polished the pontil mark.
Looks like you also collect Webb glass? :)
-
My main collection comprises Scottish Glass - Monart/Vasart/Starthearn, but I also have a small amount of Ronald Stennett-Willson glass as I much admire his work. Having said that, I cannot resist beautiful pieces whatever their origin. I scour local Car Boot sales and generally find some lovely examples of Scandinavian, Maltese and other makes of glass. Some I keep and some I sell on to fund my main collection. The Sunshine Amber bullet vase was part of a job lot at a local auction which I bought because there was a piece of Scottish and a piece of Whitefriars which I wanted. Total cost £28 and, of course I kept the Sunshine amber having fallen in love with it. This is how it goes.
John
-
... of course I kept the Sunshine amber having fallen in love with it. This is how it goes.
I know exactly what you mean and this is how collections start. The problem is knowing when to stop, of course :D
But Sunshine Amber is a very nice colour and looks glorious in sunshine (the real stuff, I mean!) – I take it you know it has a uranium content as well?
-
Yes I did, thank you all due to an earlier thread on here (page 4 Amber Glass Vase quite old). Of course I should be talking about a Sunshine Amber bullseye vase and not bullet vase. The bullet vase was the Bohemian Glass - doh!!
John