Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: fleamistress on June 23, 2005, 10:26:49 PM
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I'm clueless.
It's petite. It's old.
I don't know what to call the glass at all. Slag?
It is signed, either masked (looks like) or etched.
The sig, in script, looks like --jeguj; degiy; and so forth.
Please do not think that I haven't spent 6+ hours searching, including every variant of the signature.
Cheers!
http://tinypic.com/68ylcj.jpg
http://tinypic.com/68ylxi.jpg
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Dear Fleamistress
I think it's brilliant that you've done some research first. So many people come here and ask - and the answers easy to find for anyone on Google, so good on ya! :D
Is this your signature? http://tinypic.com/68ypuo.jpg
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Very, very close, Max. Verily. We may have a Bingo! On this tho', where you have an "s" I have a character with a dipping stem and an accent mark.
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I just went to your pic and can't figure out what yours says either.
What does it say?
Cyn
I am not a man either
but wish I was sometimes
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The last letter is an E, and it does have an accent. It's Degue (accented e) :D
Cyn, you need to get Ivo Haanstra's (he posts on this board - lovely man!) Glass Fact File a-z. It's such a useful book, every glass lover should have it.
Here's what it says about Degue: Signature found on vases made by Cristallieries de Compiegne, designed by director David Guerin (c1925 - after WWII) (art vases in the style of Galle, Schneider and Daum).
Try Google>Images>Degue, you might find something similar. :)
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I think it says LAGNY - a brand of deco cameo ware allegedly produced at Baccarat.
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But Ivo this lampshade isn't cameo ...is it ?? .....or am I really going bonkers ? (possible) :shock:
and more Nouveau than Deco !!! :roll:
and Lagny (also ?) a Baccarat stemware pattern .... :?:
I still think it's the Pervian Squirrel personally :P
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well spotted it is not cameo but frosted. Unable to diagnose your state of mind but doesn't look like bonkers to me :D . Have to disagree on nouveau vs. deco, though - what I see in the pic is very Deco.
Never came across Lagny as a stemware pattern, but any fleamarket trawl in France will turn up lighting with the Lagny brand - usually hanging bowls, sometimes with three smaller uplights, in satinated or enameled ("faux cameo") versions.
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Hi folks,
I was very interested in what Ivo & Peter have said about "Lagny" pieces. A few years ago, in the original version of this Board, somebody raised a query about a "Lagny" cameo vase and I happened to also have one but could not find anything about the maker.
I appreciate that signatures often vary within companies but for info here's my example and views of the front and back of the vase (I suppose the front is the one with the raised Dragonfly body, but I prefer the back) ...
Sig: http://tinypic.com/69ls39.jpg
One side: http://tinypic.com/69lsns.jpg
Other side: http://tinypic.com/69lt21.jpg
I bought this vase in the mid 90s (1990s :) ) and even the auctioneer commented "... not a lot of age to this one ...".
I did eventually get a response from other enquiries (can't locate that info right now) saying that Lagny was a modern company somewhere in or near Paris. Could it really be from the Baccarat works?
By the way, whether Cyn's lamp is Nouveau or Deco in style is something I could not say for sure but I don't think the signature of the lamp is the same as on my vase - but a clearer (non-flash) photo of the lamp signature would be useful.
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..... saying that Lagny was a modern company somewhere in or near Paris. Could it really be from the Baccarat works?
Lagny-sur-Marne is around 40 kms east of Paris - but no glass house in evidence, dead or alive. Not a whisper of Lagny in the Guide des Verriers, either. The Baccarat reference comes from the classical art glass literature - in fact, I think it is from one of the early Cappa books - but the attribution may have well been confusioned by the Baccarat service de table named Lagny. Wot sez Carolus about the Lagny mark, Frank?
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(http://www.ysartglass.com/Images/Mailhello.gif)
Hartmann says:
Lagny mark is c 1990 also signed as Le Maître and Le Verre (All cameo)
Company:
Le Maître
Glasgestalter, France dates unknown (But c1990)
Neuzeitlicher Kopist van Überfangglass in Stil der Firma Scheider Le Verre Français, der möglicherweise auch die Signaturen 'Lagny' (Lagny ist ein Ort östlich von Paris) und 'Le Verre' verwendet. 1930 produziert in Ponchon/Oise eine Firma Lemaitre Zerssäuber aus Kristallglas. Ob zwischen dieser Signatur und dem Betrieb ein Zusammenhang besteht, konnte bislang nicht nachgewiesen werden. Source: Katalog, Kunstgewerbemuseum Berlin 1994
Sorry, Carmen is sleeping and I am bushed (http://www.ysartglass.com/Images/Mailsleep.gif)
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Thanks for the Hartmann text, Frank.
Ok, now I remember where I got the "near Paris" bit from ... Hartmann's massive tome. Trouble is, when I first tried a translation of the text (as posted above) it did not seem to make anything clearer. And now that I have tried again (at nearly 1:30 am, while half-watching the Glastonbury festival on TV) and using an Internet translator, it still seems uncertain.
Also, (and this is in no way getting at Frank) I am not convinced that Hartmann's text, which is listed under "Le Maitre" rather than a listing for "Lagny", really helps much.
Am I right in thinking the basics of Hartmann's text is that "Lagny" is possibly a signature used by a modern company known as "Le Maitre" and that somehow there may be a link with the 1930s work of Schneider who also used the signature "Le Verre"? [The date of 1990 for "Lagny" is only listed in Hartmann in the section for "marks" - it is not stated in the main text and "Lagny" itself is also not shown in the main Index.]
By the way, according to Edith Mannoni in her book on Schneider, "Le Verre Francais" was one of the brand names for "lesser" pieces by Schneider. I suppose "Le Verre", as quoted by Hartmann, could simply be "Le Verre Francais" but missing the last part of the signature.
Anyway, I'm still as confused as I was a few years ago, and I still cannot find any other refrences to "Le Maitre" (or "Lemaitre") as a glass company or signature.
Can one of you linguists out there please give an accurate translation of the Hartmann text? And does anyone have any info on "Le Maitre"?
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Hartmann says:
Lagny mark is c 1990 also signed as Le Maître and Le Verre (All cameo)
Company:
Le Maître Glasgestalter, France dates unknown (But c1990)
Neuzeitlicher Kopist van Überfangglass in Stil der Firma Scheider Le Verre Français, der möglicherweise auch die Signaturen 'Lagny' (Lagny ist ein Ort östlich von Paris) und 'Le Verre' verwendet. 1930 produziert in Ponchon/Oise eine Firma Lemaitre Zerssäuber aus Kristallglas. Ob zwischen dieser Signatur und dem Betrieb ein Zusammenhang besteht, konnte bislang nicht nachgewiesen werden. Source: Katalog, Kunstgewerbemuseum Berlin 1994
Company: Le Maitre Glass makers, France, dates unknown
contemporary copyist of cameo glass in the style of Schneider Le Verre Français, who possibly also uses the signatures 'Lagny' (Lagny is a town east of Paris) and 'Le Verre'. In 1930 a company Lemaitre produces perfume atomisers in crystal in Ponchon/ Oise. If there is any connection between this signature and this manufacturer could until now not be established. Source: catalogue, museum of applied art, Berlin 1994.
looks speculative, to say the very least. The source seems to refer to the atomiser firm only - not to the Lagny mark.
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The convention in Hartmann is to date each signature in the marks section.
Without seeing the source he refers to it is hard to know how he made the connection, but as each signature has the same text it might be safe to assume that all three were referred to in the same catalogue.
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Ivo wrote:
but no glass house in evidence, dead or alive.
According to the history of the commune, the first glass-works was built at Lagny sur Marne, in the 1750's and was known as the verrerie de Bagneaux. website reference to follow. http://dgw77.free.fr/histoire.htm
Regards,
Marcus
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Just goes to show, everything gets forgotten until it gets on-line.
I suppose the challenge is gathering this data while it is available as it could vanish as easily.
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Re Degué
http://www.kanne-kruike.nl/Merkeninfo/Merk9E.html
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:twisted: I have a gorgeous Lagny genuine cameo glass lamp that is on a par with Galle lamps in terms of workmanship, and certainly dates from 1900-1930. The wrought base is, I believe, also original as it has leaves that complement the detail in the shade. I would like to hear from anyone who knows anything certain about the Lagny manufacturer.