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Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: Paul S. on March 07, 2011, 08:47:25 PM

Title: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 07, 2011, 08:47:25 PM
very stylized, although guess it is supposed to be something like a swan or mythical water bird.   When I first picked it up I though it was just opalecent, but as you can see, when viewed against bright sunlight it shows the firey glow of opaline - do people agree, and is this an uncommon process with tourist Murano?   Very top to bottom is is about 9"/230mm, and remarkably without any damage.  I have seen a variety of birds and ducks etc. but not one in opaline - and especially pleased that it has the label intact still.     Very grateful for any guide to age please, and thanks for looking :)
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: antiquerose123 on March 07, 2011, 09:36:10 PM
 :hi: Paul:

Your Label is Fratelli Toso....as that is what I have on my big vase here.  I think my label is in the Glass Gallery  HERE (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?album=102&pos=10)   and for other Murano labels  See here-Glass Gallery  (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/thumbnails.php?album=102)

Good one  :hiclp: :hiclp: :hiclp: :thup:
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: TxSilver on March 07, 2011, 09:40:16 PM
Rose is right in the ID. It is a type of glass known as opalino. These types of bowls were made c. 1960. It's a very pretty bowl. Many people like this shade of opalino.
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 07, 2011, 10:11:03 PM
Ladies, very many thanks indeed to both of you, especially antiquerose for being so quick with the answer and the links.    I try to avoid animals etc., but guess most of us here would fall victim to bringing home something like this.    I now have three pieces of opaline, although apart from this one they are from late C19 - early C20, where you might more usually expect to find them.  thanks again :thup:
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: rosieposie on March 08, 2011, 10:40:54 AM
Very beautiful Paul, and how lucky to have no damage and still have the label..... :thup:

Can anyone explain the difference between opaline and opalescent please? :usd:
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: tam bam on March 08, 2011, 01:52:04 PM
Here is the definition of opaline - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opaline_glass  Here is an example also:  http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/murano-venini-blue-opaline-glass-11-vase-signed

Here is the definition of opalescent - http://reviews.ebay.com/Opalescent-Glass-What-is-it_W0QQugidZ10000000000954451

I hope this helps, Rosie.   ;)

tam bam
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: rosieposie on March 08, 2011, 03:00:27 PM
Thank you Tam Bam,  I will read those a few times until I feel I really understand the difference......at the moment, I see Paul's swan as opalescent. :pb: because my squirrel has the same fiery red colour when shown in bright light, but almost impossible to catch on a photo. and I thought that was like my little birds as well?????
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Lustrousstone on March 08, 2011, 07:05:33 PM
Hmm, I'm not sure about those definitions because Paul's swan is definitely opalescent
http://www.glassencyclopedia.com/opalescentglass.html
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: tam bam on March 08, 2011, 07:12:21 PM
Your so very welcome, Rosie.  I have two opalescent AS jars my husband bought from Anita about a year ago.  I'll post those for you.  I also have a Venini opaline vase.  I will also post it for you.  :)

tam bam
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: tam bam on March 08, 2011, 07:35:33 PM
I see what you are saying Christine.  The wikipedia definition is not what I expected it to be for opaline glass.  Sorry about that.  I just noticed it.  I was in a hurry and didn't read it all the way through.  Here is a pair of lamps I found.  http://www.1stdibs.com/furniture_item_detail.php?id=446391  These are a better example and is what I think of when I think opaline glass.  But the swan (which is very nice, btw) is opalescent for sure.  I see fire in it like an opal.  That is how I try to keep the two straight in my mind.     
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Lustrousstone on March 08, 2011, 07:46:21 PM
I think opalescent is the easy definition!!
Ivo in his book Glass Fact File A-Z defines opaline as "semi-transparent glass originally made with bone ash, later with tin or arsenic" and opalino as the "Italian term for lattimo (white opaque glass) cased with a layer of clear coloured glass".

Opaline would be the one requiring reheating to produce the required effect
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: tam bam on March 08, 2011, 08:02:45 PM
Thanks, Christine.  I believe I have opaline and opalino confused.  Sorry to confuse you, Rosie.  Trust Christine's answer as I was confused regarding opaline and opalino.  I see now they are totally different effects.  

tam bam

P.S. - I agree opalescent is a lot easier. 
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 08, 2011, 08:28:42 PM
the mistake is as much mine as anyone else  -  it was me that used the word in the first place, so apologies for the initial confusion.    I had thought always that opaline was the one which gave the 'sunset' glow.    However, I was wrong, and stand corrected, and my sincere thanks to Lustrousstone for her technical expertise and help.    So, now I know, and just to show that I know, am going to bore you all with three pieces of 'opalescent' glass, just to prove I can tell the difference (each in ordinary view, and then with a lighted backdrop).     In the event it would appear that I do not have any 'opaline' at all, so must go out and try and find some ;).
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 08, 2011, 08:30:35 PM
and the other two  :)
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 08, 2011, 08:36:37 PM
oh gawd - just reaized that I may have got the description of the U. pot wrong.    I bet it's Vaseline opalescent...........cringe :pb:
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Lustrousstone on March 08, 2011, 08:38:40 PM
It's still opalescent Paul...
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: rosieposie on March 08, 2011, 09:14:24 PM
Paul, you have the knack of finding the most unusual glass and then be very unassuming about it ( I think that's the word I mean).  You take it all so casually and yet they are true FINDS and I have yet to be able to identify any of it despite trawling the web all over the world to find lookalikes that might actually be labelled or named. 

Methinks you have a furnace in one of your sheds and you churn them out to confuse us!! :ooh:
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: Paul S. on March 08, 2011, 10:16:09 PM
shhhh  -   I can't type just now - my wife has gone to bed and she complains that my tapping the keyboard keeps her awake.    Will talk to you tomorrow, and will put the wabbit to one side for you for when we next meet.   Its twenty eight pounds thirteen shillings and ninepence threefarthings, plus p. & p., plus purchse tax. ;D
Title: Re: date request for Murano bird (swan?)
Post by: rosieposie on March 08, 2011, 10:40:41 PM
Ooooh! Paul, what about 'Hush Hush' money!!?? >:D