Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: wrightoutlook on November 09, 2006, 02:01:55 PM
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I recently purchased two Phoenix paperweights and would like to know more about them. These works showcase the exceptional talents of Scottish glassmakers, which seems neverending.
Therefore, I am looking for information about Phoenix Paperweights, which was a short-lived studio that made paperweights in 2002 and perhaps a year before or after. I understand it was an off-shoot of the closed Perthshire factory. Both weights are scratch-signed Phoenix and 2002 with edition numbers.
But who specifically were the artisans? When did they actually start their studio? When did it close its doors? And after their enterprise quickly and sadly shut down, where did the persons (men or women) who comprised the studio go? Are they still working in glass? There are similarities between Phoenix and other Scottish glass paperweights (including Peter McDougall's work), but I assume he is working solo with some apprentice assistance.
As always, thank you.
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4052
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"Phoenix Paperweights operates out of the Manson works in Perth, Scotland, where William Manson Sr. has joined forces with three former Perthshire Paperweight artisans. The group was formed in part due to Manson's concern for losing significant talent and experience in the field when Perthshire Paperweights decided to close its doors.
In response, Phoenix Paperweights rose from the ashes of Perthshire, with the talents of David McNichol-maker, Duncan Smith-lampworking, and Gordon Taylor, glasscutting. They bring over 55 years of combined paperweight making experience to Phoenix Paperweights.
Phoenix uses a "PP" signature cane. Joyce Manson, spokeswoman for Phoenix Paperweights, announced in June that both Phoenix Paperweights & William Manson Studio would close at the end of August 2003."
The GPSA Gazette, Vol. 14 October 2003
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I think the arrangement was far more informal. At the time Willie Manson was working out of his small studio in Perth with Willie junior and Joyce. It was about this time - 2003 that me and the mrs attended their wonderful master class. Duncan's lampwork and Gordon's cutting could be done at home or at the studio and David would use spare capacity at the studio to make the weights. No doubt there was the usual cross fertilisation. As stated, the arrangement only lasted up until the Mansons closed down the studio, and a limited number of phoenix weights were made. Of course since then Willie has collaborated with John D eacon.
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Just a small contribution to the story from me;Due to reasons that I am not definite about,a fair amount of the weights made under the Phoenix name were actually made by Willie himself with the lampwork done by my good friend and ex colleague, Rosette Fleming.
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Hi all
Martin you are right it was a very informal arrangement ! The press release that Leni posted was just that ! I second what you say about the Willie Manson Masterclass - I went on what was to turn out to be the very last one. It was a week to remember - just a shame that they stopped.
I was at JDs in August and he is looking seriously at running some although in a somewhat different style.
Allan - that backs up what Dave has told me that the vast majority of the Phoenix weights were Willie Mansons with lampwork from Rosette.
Dave knows more of the story - I will leave to him to complete it!
Regards
Derek
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The "press release" is actually a bit confusing and seems to flip verb tenses and transposes elements relating to dates.
So, thanks Martin, Allan, and Derek for adding vital and much-needed information.
But, now I am even more curious.
Why would William Manson have "created" Phoenix and then why did he stop just as quickly? The paperweights do look like they rise out of the Perthshire-McDougall-Manson "school" of weightmaking. So why "invent" a new "factory" or "studio" name if Manson made them?
Any idea as to how many designs were crafted? And who is Rosette? Is there more information about her? How was she connected to Manson? Is she still working in the field? And did William Manson, Jr. contribute to the making of the weights?
Thanks again.
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I was sad to see Phoenix close so quickly. I have one of their weights. I thought it looked very "Manson-esque" rather than "Perthshire-esque. It has a white ground, lovely candy cane like aventurine twists and the PP cane in the centre.
The Phoenix weights are very beautiful. Alas they were gone and their weights hard to find by the time I could afford another one. I am very happy I have my one sparkly weight.
I too am very curious as to why Phoenix was so ephemeral.
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I think Willie "created" Phoenix with and for the other guys as an outlet for their talent. As wrighty says says they are a different style to the WM/j d weights and anyway, he would want to retain his brand separately. Note that a VW is an Audi is a Skoda is a Seat. Different bodywork but Golf, Beetle, A3, TT, Octavia, Leon are all based on the same floorplan but VW retain separate branding.
As I mentioned earlier, there was cross fertilisation and WM would have made / helped make the PP weigts.
I seem to recall two series of 12 weights PP1-PP12 and PP13-24.
Rosette Fleming is a very fine Caithness lampworker (according to Frank's Scottish glass site, trained by Allan Scott .
WM Juniorwas a very good glass maker on his own and would have been involved in the making of these weight
From an English Paperweight Collector
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for info. These are my couple of Phoenix weights (one being the top facetted version of one of WOs )
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4060
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-4061
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Looking on ebay and found this weight (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180047567120&fromMakeTrack=true) and very nice it is too. It is made by Willie Manson (http://www.ysartglass.com/Otherglass/WilMansonGls.htm) and John Deacons (http://www.ysartglass.com/Otherglass/JohnDeacons2.htm)
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I will say this, the original comment about the Phoenix paperweights is interesting. They are very lovely weights.
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Certain parts of this thread have been removed.
The discussion about the person in question is not for the Committee to resolve. It is something which only the board owner, can change if and when she and person involved decide to do so. Further speculation on the board about the reasons and about any activity taken or not taken by the Committee is not helpful, and we would request that you respect the situation as is until such time as those involved are agreeable to it being changed.
Thank you.
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As I mentioned earlier, there was cross fertilisation and WM would have made / helped make the PP weights.
I seem to recall two series of 12 weights PP1-PP12 and PP13-24.
Rosette Fleming is a very fine Caithness lampworker (according to Frank's Scottish glass site, trained by Allan Scott .
WM Junior was a very good glass maker on his own and would have been involved in the making of these weights.
Thanks MJR for the information. I gather that the thread got a tad off-topic. Anyway, I am always interested in hearing that a woman is involved in the making of any paperweights, which has mostly been a male-dominated industry/art form. It was good to read about Ms. Fleming. Some other information may have been lost due to pulled posts.
So, can we clarify and certify the mythology and intent of Phoenix Paperweights? The name, of course, comes from the mythological bird that rose again, which seems to imply that Phoenix Paperweights rose from something failed.
Therefore, is the assumption correct that it was NOT created as an off-shoot of, or a reaction to, the closed Perthshire factory? Or was it? Did William Manson, Sr. see an opportunity to take on a couple of, or a few, people from Perthshire and create a mini-studio within his own studio?
Looking at my own two new Phoenix works and seeing photos of others, especially MJR's beauties, there's no doubt that these paperweights are of the highest quality. Of course, these Phoenix creations and the intrique surrounding their manufacture add to the fascinating puzzle that is the glass paperweight.
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So, can we clarify and certify the mythology and intent of Phoenix Paperweights? ... is the assumption correct that it was NOT created as an off-shoot of, or a reaction to, the closed Perthshire factory? Or was it?
The creation of Phoenix Paperweights was, as stated by others, a "reaction" to the closure of Perthshire Paperweights [in Jan 2002]. It was intended to provide a means for the three workers mentioned to be able to continue weights in the Perthshire Paperweights style and quality.
The official launch (announcement) was made at the 8 June 2002 meeting of the Cambrdige Paperweight Circle. Willie and Joyce Manson were short notice guest speakers after the original speaker had unfortunately been unable to attend. The initial 12 master samples of the Phoenix Paperweights products were first shown at that CPC meeting.
I can add nothing to what others have said about the actual makers of the Phoenix range of weights.
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Thanks Kevin.