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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: Wuff on January 17, 2007, 09:29:46 PM

Title: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Wuff on January 17, 2007, 09:29:46 PM
http://cgi.ebay.ch/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150081541840
offers a "Beautiful Paul Ysart paperweight with PY cane" - but the cane looks to me like the "dropped Y" cane described on
http://www.btinternet.com/~kevh.glass/pages/fake-py/fake-py-weights.htm

What do others feel - should the seller be informed?

Best regards  -  Wolf
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: glasstrufflehunter on January 17, 2007, 10:20:40 PM
Wow, that page is an excellent reference! Based on that page, it does look like that weight is a fake.

It actually a shame that whoever made these fakes did not put their own signature to the work because they made nice weights.
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on January 17, 2007, 10:46:02 PM
Maybe they did >:D but it was more than one maker.
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: KevinH on January 18, 2007, 12:09:37 AM
The seller was informed, and has apparently also had mixed comments from others, but as yet has chosen not to update the listing.
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on January 29, 2007, 06:25:21 PM
That one reached £99. But this one is going higher http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220074475098 demand for fakes continues. This latest one is from the earliest faking episode but how long before we get a third type?
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: daveweight on January 30, 2007, 06:51:16 PM
I was one of those who contacted the seller and advised this was definitely a fake. She said she would advise the winning bidder of this but whether they were informed or not I do not know
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on January 30, 2007, 07:57:35 PM
She responded to at least one question on line, refusing an early end... but curiously not those, me too, that advised it was fake. I do think the seller was well aware just from the question mark in the title. Probably it was bought by someone aware of what they were buying. It is without doubt one of the better of the first round of fakes, sadly I do not have a clearer picture of it.
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: karelm on January 30, 2007, 10:50:07 PM
Hmmmmmm..Shouldnt be to difficult to let the buyer know >:D >:D >:D
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on January 30, 2007, 11:41:03 PM
Will ask them for a picture ;)
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on February 01, 2007, 04:23:16 PM
Another type not seen so often: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170070723706

Copied from here: http://www.ysartglass.com/BaseLabel/Labels.htm#Paul

But using the wrong tool. It has also been found on a few pieces of glassware in recent years. ;D

Any ideas who made the weight?
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Sue C on February 01, 2007, 04:58:08 PM
Frank, could it be a Malcolm Sutcliffe one?
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: karelm on February 02, 2007, 09:17:49 AM
Had the oppertunity to speak to a professional engraver (NOT the guy who engraves trinkets at the local mall, this guy creates art, saw one glass with a Don Quioty (sp??) that took 40 hours to engrave!!).
He told me some horror stories of what he has been asked to engrave on pieces here in Vienna.
He became a bit elusive when I asked him if he refused to do the engraving!  Loetz vase anybody? ;D
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: Frank on February 02, 2007, 10:33:20 AM
I have no idea who it could be.

Also familiar with professional restorers doing things that are not quite right, though often they could argue that they do not know the effect of what they are doing. Adding a polished outer ring "because the vase wobbled" to a piece of Vasart or Strathearn would make it more like Monart, but when it comes to grinding off Strathearn seals what excuse can be used.

The sig on this weight looks like a dremel job, so could even be a recycled Chrism (The eBay signature forger), instead of a diamond point. As Paul only signed for personal visitors, there is an extremely low possibility of a signed piece being sold without an accurate description and history.
Title: Re: Faked Ysart ?
Post by: KevinH on February 02, 2007, 12:07:29 PM
Quote
As Paul only signed for personal visitors, there is an extremely low possibility of a signed piece being sold without an accurate description and history.
If only it were that simple! There are quite a few examples of script-signed P. Ysart weights that have been through the market place at least twice. These do not necessarily retain the "descrption and history" by the time of the second selling.

As yet, the eBay weight referred to is the first I have seen which is obviously wrong. Apart from the look of the signature, the weight is simply not an Ysart piece of work. I, too, have no idea who actually made the weight.

Of the genuine script "P. Ysart" signatures I have seen on weights and bottles, most are very similar but some look a bit different. I have four examples in my collection and one shows a very "wobbly" signature, but the weight is ok, and is certainly from the 1970s period. I suspect that Paul signed that weight when he was quite elderly and his hand (let alone his eyesight) was not as good as it used to be. All of those four signatures can be seen in my web pages.

A specific point about the wrong signature on the eBay weight is that there are certain elements that do not match the genuine ones - even my "wobbly" one. And this is, so far, true of all the other genuine examples I have seen. So, if anybody fancies copying the signatures based on my web page images, they really should study them very carefully to get every aspect correct. But even then, without hours and hours of practice, it is unlikely that a copier will get it right with the proper flowing style that Paul used.

With this info in mind, if any GMB member finds a script-signed "P Ysart" item, post a photo (if you can get one - the sigs are not always easy to capture) and I can certainly check it for the specific details.