Glass Message Board

Glass Discussion & Research. No ID requests here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: Greg. on January 29, 2012, 05:28:43 PM

Title: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on January 29, 2012, 05:28:43 PM
Hi,

Trying to find out a little more on this white opalescent lidded bowl, or perhaps powder bowl.

Measures approx 10cm wide and 10cm tall.

Faint pontil mark to the base.

Any thoughts greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Greg

 :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Paul S. on January 29, 2012, 05:49:05 PM
could be wrong Greg, but that doesn't look like a pontil mark to me  -  either snapped or ground/polished.   More like an impression of some description from a mould.   Sorry to be less than helpful - but otherwise a very nice looking lidded pot. :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on January 29, 2012, 06:00:31 PM
I think your right Paul, I was a little unsure about the finish to the base.

Not my usual thing, but as you say, quite a nice looking pot all in all.

 :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: glassobsessed on January 29, 2012, 06:31:19 PM
Here is one I tried to id a while ago: http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,43107.0.html

I think I had one the exact same shape as yours in uranium glass, I can not find any photos of it and I do not remember what happened to it but there is a vague chance I gave it to Christine....

John
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on January 29, 2012, 07:11:14 PM
Thanks John, I vaguely recall the one in the link.

Interesting that your uranium one was the exact same shape, do you recall what the base looked like on that one..?

Thanks
Greg
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: glassobsessed on January 29, 2012, 07:27:53 PM
Like yours - flat and moulded.
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Lustrousstone on January 30, 2012, 06:37:00 PM
You did John  :kissy: My guess is Italian
http://lustrousstone.co.uk/cpg/displayimage.php?pid=1000
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: glassobsessed on January 30, 2012, 07:42:29 PM
 ;D

The two ridges that run around the pot triggered my ailing memory, they seem fairly distinctive.

John
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on January 30, 2012, 11:10:59 PM
Thanks for adding the link Christine, much appreciated.

They do indeed look very similar.

Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on February 06, 2012, 08:26:48 PM
Just noticed this one online, courtesy of Wayne, with a generic Murano/Empoli label.

Difficult to pinpoint exact manufacturer, although certainly Italian as you guessed Christine.  :thup:


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Empoli-Italian-Blue-Opaline-Glass-Trinket-Pot-Labelled-/360415611243?pt=UK_Art_Glass&hash=item53ea71c96b#ht_2215wt_952


Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Lustrousstone on February 06, 2012, 09:06:48 PM
Well spotted Greg  :hiclp:
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Tigerchips on February 06, 2012, 10:12:47 PM
Unusually the label has a big letter 'N' on the left hand side but the label has faded on the Ebay one like it does on many others.
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: flying free on February 06, 2012, 10:23:57 PM
The label says Veritable Opaline de Murano.  Does this mean it's a Murano piece rather than Empoli?  or is that just the 'name' of the company as it were.
m
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on February 07, 2012, 12:05:35 PM
Thanks all, that's helpful info.

Just found a label where the letter 'N' on the left wasn't faded. I understand that the letter 'N' is likely to stand for 'Nason'

Looking at 'V Nason & Co' I gather they traded under the names VNC and 'Veritable Opaline' up until the late 80s, which would tie in with the label.

So likely to be have been produced by V Nason & Co, under their previous trading name of 'Veritable Opaline', some time between 1970 and 1985.

The web is certainly a wonderful resource!

Thanks all.

 :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Lustrousstone on February 07, 2012, 12:37:10 PM
Even better  :kissy:
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: flying free on February 07, 2012, 02:13:59 PM
excellent  :sun:
m
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Tigerchips on February 07, 2012, 08:35:10 PM
I don't think David was 100% certain that it was a V Nason label.

Just to confuse us, there's a label printed with 'Veritable Opaline Florence', and that label is the same shape as the 'VB Opaline Florence' labels. Both labels are currently unidentified. They probably just used the same labels as i'm sure if VB Opaline Florence pieces were by V Nason they would have used the Murano name, probably.  :thud:
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Greg. on February 07, 2012, 10:27:38 PM
Thanks TC -Its certainly a minefield! - So likely to be by V Nason, although not definitive.  :-\

The Florence labels are certainly another confusing factor, as you suggest, lets hope the omission of the Murano name on these suggests they aren't by V Nason!

Its a shame that V Nason are no longer in business as it would be well worth an email to try and definitively attribute these labels. I wonder if any other manufacturers / competitors would recognise any of these labels, that's if their still running!

Thanks for your thoughts.

Greg :)


Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Any Info Appreciated...
Post by: Anne on February 09, 2012, 06:30:34 PM
I'll move this over to Murano forum and see if we can catch the eye of one of the Murano people.
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Wayne on February 09, 2012, 07:02:16 PM
I just did an image search for "veritable opaline murano" and there is a diamond shaped dish/ashtray, black with copper aventurine, part of the Avventurina range by V Nason if anyone knows what I mean by that, and it looks to have the label mentioned here, "Veritable Opaline Murano" with the letter N.

Trouble is, it's a small thumbnail, and when I click it, the page that it is on has updated, and the pic is no longer there.  I've had a quick look around but been unable to find it, and have to go out now.  Just thought I'd mention it in case it helps, as it would confirm that this label is actually a V Nason label.

This link *might* show it  :X:: [Link (http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=%22veritable+opaline+murano%22&hl=en&rlz=1R2GGNI_en-GBGB467&biw=1440&bih=754&tbm=isch&tbnid=XpVRmzkXXTtqIM:&imgrefurl=http://annonces.ebay.fr/allitems/Provence-Alpes-Cote-dAzur/Antiquites-et-collections/Ceramiques-et-Verres%3Fkw%3Dmurano&docid=ciAWh8ToH4u-xM&imgurl=http://fr.ebayimg.com/00/s/NzY4WDEwMjQ%253D/%2524(KGrHqV,!gsE5tGVC6QUBOiKejLSK!~~60_7.JPG%253Fset_id%253D8800005007&w=150&h=112&ei=ThY0T8OhMafV0QWj_9WqAg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=1&sig=113501859758483868906&page=2&tbnh=89&tbnw=120&start=34&ndsp=38&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:34&tx=78&ty=49)]
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Ivo on February 09, 2012, 07:18:15 PM
I don't think anyone should jump to conclusions.
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 09, 2012, 09:39:28 PM
Thanks Wayne, I did send a picture of the label to the research department of one of the glass museums in Murano, who said they would be happy to take a look. I'll let you know if I hear anything back. Would be good to get a answer to this one.

Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 09, 2012, 10:03:02 PM
Just spotted this one, same lidded pot but with gilt mounts. The picture doesn't show the label, although the description, mentions the label is worded: "VNC, Opaline de Venise, Hand Made in Italy" Could V. Nason, have used this label, whilst trading under the name 'VNC' and then used the other label later, whilst trading under the name 'Veritable Opaline'...?

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/v-nason-murano-italy-opaline-art-glass-gilt


Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 09, 2012, 10:45:52 PM
Here's the same lidded pot as in the last link, with gilt mounts, this time with the 'Veritable Opaline' label. Surely, this label, therefore has to relate to V. Nason..?

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/veritable-opaline-de-murano-vintage-172064210



Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: flying free on February 09, 2012, 11:15:51 PM
Greg, I can't see any of the labels closely enough on any of the links unfortunately, and your fingers crossed link to the avventurine piece didn't work for me.  Was the label on the Avventurine piece exactly the same as some found on the opaline pieces? 
m
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 09, 2012, 11:35:12 PM
Hi M,  :hi: the fingers crossed link was one of Wayne's posts.

The picture in the first link of mine, does enlarge, however the label is too faint to read the wording, although the description details the wording on the label "VNC, Opaline de Venise, Hand Made in Italy" which is a known V Nason label.

The picture in the second link does also enlarge, when clicking into it, the label here is the one in question the 'Veritable Opaline de Murano' one. Given that both pieces are the same, I would hope its safe to say the 'Veritable Opaline' label is also by V. Nason...?

Greg
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: flying free on February 10, 2012, 12:12:16 AM
 :-[ oops sorry Greg - I wasn't reading who had posted properly.
m
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Lustrousstone on February 10, 2012, 07:29:31 AM
Those blue pots are only similar, not the same
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Wayne on February 10, 2012, 08:24:47 AM
This link might work better for the Avventurina item:

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQLHSbHib6wR3BBRk7GNtKG_sZOGvpRnpUbJX6p4nnQPVIHd8BA7eOy3DsV

The thumbnail is really small though.
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Wayne on February 10, 2012, 09:33:15 AM
Interesting thread here about V Nason, Veritable Opaline de Murano etc:

http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,3882.0.html

*edit* and some info here on the labels:

http://www.glassyeye.com/glassmarks/nason.html
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 10, 2012, 09:55:55 AM
Thanks Wayne, both links were thoughts/suggestions from David regarding V Nason and Veritable Opaline de Murano. I came across these earlier, although as TC mentioned earlier, I don't think David was 100% certain that the Veritable Opaline de Murano label was definitively a V. Nason one. However, it does look very likely, would just be nice to get some definitive evidence to prove conclusively. I'll keep digging around.

Thanks again.

Greg
 :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Wayne on February 10, 2012, 10:21:12 AM
Me too, it's an interesting mystery, especially how similar in style the glass and the labels are to Empoli glassware.

Here's another pot very similar to the two you linked Greg, this one is labelled V Nason:

http://www.ebay.com.sg/itm/230716422851
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Tigerchips on February 10, 2012, 02:28:51 PM
I have two photo's (they don't belong to me so can't post) of identical shaped vases, one bears the Veritable Opaline de Murano' label and the other 'VNC Opaline de Venice' label. The only differences are the colours, one is blue and the other is white, and one has gold decoration around the rim.

So that's at least one match. That doesn't rule out that the 'Veritable Opaline de Murano' could belong to an importer though.  :24:
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 21, 2012, 02:04:36 PM
I'm exceedingly happy to have finally managed to get a definitive answer on this label!

I must thank Davide Salvadore, who very kindly looked into the background of this label for me. For anyone whose not aware, amongst Davide Salvadore's vast experience within the glass industry, he spent some time working for Vincenzo Nason. Whilst, not being able to immediately confirm the origins of the label, Davide, kindly, contacted an old friend of his who previously worked in the sales department of V.N.for many years.

To quote Davide Salvadore's kind response to my email:
"I was informed by an old friend who worked in the sales department of V.N.for many years(Barbini Gianpaolo) . To confirm that the label was used by V.N. from the early 60's until the late 80, and that N was for Nason .He says that V.N.was founded as a family company Nason , but over the years 80 Vincenzo became the owner,and that was adding the V."
Hoping to be of help.

Davide
http://www.davidesalvadore.com/info.html

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread and especially Davide Salvadore, who helped confirm the origins of this label!

Greg  :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Wayne on February 21, 2012, 02:34:30 PM
 :hiclp:  Well done Greg, it's great that this label can be confirmed as a V Nason label! 
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Greg. on February 21, 2012, 04:44:29 PM
Thanks Wayne  :)
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Tigerchips on February 21, 2012, 07:51:07 PM
Well done indeed.  :hiclp:
Title: Re: Opalescent Lidded Bowl / Powder Bowl - Veritable Opaline de Murano ?
Post by: Lustrousstone on February 21, 2012, 08:25:43 PM
Brilliant, thank you  :clap: :clap: