Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Murano & Italy Glass => Topic started by: antiquerose123 on February 10, 2008, 01:08:08 AM
-
Does anyone know about a paper label rectanglaur shape, with like the corners concaved clipped, and just a number on it....or info/age? It has blue going around the edges, with like a design of a line, and a dash repeating.
And the number on it...what is that for...can that pinpoint anything?
Are these older then the foil labels? THXS
-
rose can you get a picture of the label and the piece. that would help a lot :)
bidda
-
Sounds like it might be a pattern number, but as Bidda says...must have a photo! :)
-
here it is....
-
OK, that's better, now we can see the label. :) Rose, the number is hand-written. Is it in biro or inkpen ink? If biro then it's going to be mid 20th century - see here for the dates of biros (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_B%C3%ADr%C3%B3) - but remember they weren't in common use until after the end of the second world war. We talked about biros somewhere else on the board a while back and in the late 1940s/early 1950s they were still a luxury cost item.
-
??
??
-
This sort of label looks unlikely to be traceable. It could be a manufacturer's product code label, it could be a retailer's stock code label. Sticky paper labels have been around for years and are still handwritten on by small dealers.
-
Anne, is "biro" synonymous with "ball point pen" or is there some discernable difference in the inks used?
also, i agree with Christine that this label could have been placed by nearly anybody at any stage (manufacture, import, retail, etc.) in the early life of this piece. i believe the label itself is on par with those that are used in price guns today... nothing striking, really, to distinguish one from another.
if you're still curious about date/possible maker, a picture of the whole piece would be helpful.
bidda
-
Biro is a registered trademark for a ball point pen, the inventor of said pens was László BÃró according to Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1szl%C3%B3_B%C3%ADr%C3%B3).
Now used as another word for any ball point pen.
-
Hi, first of all, can MOD please combine this with topic with: Just a question: About paper labels (not foil)
As this goes with that topic, but IF I added the pix in there after, I was afraid the topic (pix) might be missed, since other Topic stated that it was JUST a question.....
Any help on this figure - maker, age, where....Etc, etc THX
(Hope I did OK...) :-\
-
Looks like a Barovier figure from the thirties or forties.
-
Fratelli Toso used this type of label. I have not seen it personally, but the Loschs have a label posted at http://www.the-loschs.com/sigitaly.htm
Does the bowl look like it could be FT, antiquerose?
Anita
-
I see the figure itself. My guess from the label would be Fratelli Toso. I haven't seen this figure before, but they did a lot of different things. I'm glad it still had a label.
Anita
-
Thanks TxSilver:
I been googling around here some too. I did note that some figures have like solid bases, not swirled ones. So I googled that, and came up with this site:
http://www.goantiques.com/detail,rare-pair-salviati,1464777.html (click other images to see the male)
In there it says something about a pat'd SALVIATI swirled base with gold flecks in the writeup. Also (so far) this has been the only picture I have stumbled upon where on the legs - it has glass swirls going up to about the knees.
But, I am most likely wrong as usual, but I thought I would mention this site.....(??) and see if there were others makers that made figures with the swirled base, and legs. :huh:
As for the label TxSilver....I am glad it still was there too.
Thxs
ADD: I just went back, and reread that link myself. I note mine has a "crimped leaf" at the base, the swirls (as mentioned above-on the legs), and the hat of mine has a little snapped off pontil mark on it, too. What is anyone views on this comparsion? All I was trying to do was find a murano figurine with a swirled base. The link above dates those to around 1870 - 1910. :o
Am I way off in left-field? And how far? :huh: Or what?
-
Great site TxSilver....
Please note, this is not a bowl, but a figurine. I have now posted this object under a NEW TOPIC of: "Glass Figure - On Swirled Base w/label"
I did not post item here, as this topic post is a query of JUST A QUESTION. So the label that goes with this figurine in under a new topic here, in which I did ask the MOD to combine (if, they so wish).
Also, I have been digging here too, or (trying) and have came up empty handed too. The only place where I have found anything similiar:
http://www.great-glass.co.uk/glass%20notes/markt-z.htm
Title of label: Compania di Venezia e Murano, Italy about 12 items down. A rectangle paper label, with the corners clipped, and scalloped some. The notation there says: Paper label late 19th C.
My label is only the same in shape, design, and material (paper). The inside writing on the paper label *in the LINK is different*, but this is the only similar shape I have found, and is paper....
I am just guessing, with *key-words* every time I googled.....to see what comes up.
This alone, is just a GREAT TOPIC on old labels itself. :thumbs_up:
thxs ;)
-
Site found: Fratelli Toso, and Salviati with some history dates.
:) click here-interesting (http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:Mc5o887vL6sJ:creativecollectibleconcepts.com/muranoinfo.html
+fratelli+toso+figurines+and+salviati&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=ca) :)
-
Antiquerose, did you check the Losch site? It is the last label on the ninth row. Just click the link above.
Anita
-
That Losch label in itself is no indication of much though, only that this brand of label was available in Italy. That one looks hand stamped
-
Hi,
Yes TxSilver I did. At first I missed it, but then looked again and saw it (row 9, last one). Yes, to me it looks like a match. The coloring, the shape, the design (line/space/then a dot). So to me it looks the same, but I DO wear glasses...lol.
I also noted (only in reference to design border=the line/space/dot issue) on label in the 9th row. On row 4 there is another label that has the line/space/dot border (shape is different). I ONLY make reference due only to the border, not shape. So there are two examples there with the line/space/dot border -- but row 9 seems to match right on.
Then on great-glass link shows JUST another example of a SHAPE similiar.
:huh: Did you look at the link ( http://www.goantiques.com/detail,rare-pair-salviati,1464777.html ) where it shows figures with a swirled base there, and says this was a pat'd design of SALVIATI ??
The label I have is in a bit better condition than example shown there. This is good for us here on the GMB, as I will add to the gallery of labels.
:)
QUESTION TO MOD'S: Do you/should these two topics be combined. This has been a GREAT TOPIC discussing paper labels, but (maybe) when reference to the label/figurine we are talking about -- maybe these should be combined. I will leave it to your discreation. Thxs.
-
Did Fratelli Toso make figures like this? Does anyone have reference to links similiar to this? In my googling, all I could find with a swirled base was the one on "Go Antiques" link above....that one there (in only my opinion) looks similar so much in style.(?)
Your opinions comparing the two, greatly appreciated..
Any other links of figurines with swirled bases that you know of? Any examples of figures like this done by FT?
A bit confused here yet....but then I AM MOST days anyhow.......lol.
Thxs as always
-
Many, if not all, the large Murano companies did figures like this. The companies were in the business to make money and the human figures probably sold very well. The cased, bright red and black, along with the label, make me think FT is a pretty good company to start the search. I don't know of a site that has the human figurines. I run across them occasionally when I am looking for other things. Maybe we will be able to find yours somewhere.
Anita
-
:hb2: and I have something else to tell you (also) as I hit my head on the wall.....
Back last year (November) when I went to an Antiques show here the guy had the two (male/female) figurines for sale. These, were a matched set. I looked at them, and then asked why the female was so cheap. Here the female figure had been broke. He wanted $68 dollars for her, but was willing to sell her to me for $45. I thought about it, and thought what good was it to only by the female, and not the male. He wanted more (about a $150 more for the male).
I thought about buying the female (but never thought in the long haul) that I would be buying the male. So at the time, I thought if I could not afford both...then why buy one, and the female was the one that had been broken (but repaired beautifully). I thought about buying her--held her in my hands. I did NOT want her to be split from her glass partner. Also due to the fact she had been broken, but repaired. So I said NO, and gave her back to the dealer.....never for her to touch my hands
Fast forward to 2008...
Antique show on again, the same man there, but female figure was gone. I inquired if she had gotten sold at the last show (or IF, he just did not bring her this time). No -- she had been sold. The guy remembered me, and said he only has the male left now (as I KICK MYSELF). I hummed, and hawed about, mad at myself that I had not purchased them both last year.
This time, I was not thinking about it. I did not care if it had a label or not, or that this was a bit more than I wanted to spend. He knew I was in love with them last year. We talked about his price (which was firm), but did come down quite a bit for me, almost $100 dollars less, but I still paid over a hundred dollars for the Male.
Moral of the story -- I know that somewhere out there around here -- in this prairie city, there is somebody that has the broken (but repaired) matched figurine for this male. I will be searching. I may contact the sellar -- just to see by chance, if he may have retained (or have) photos of what the female looked like. For my knowledge, and the board....
God - last year I could have bought them both -- the set, but my ignorance because the female had been broken and repaired, I did not. Now I have only the male.......
But I WILL search for her around here, and ask the seller if he kept any records (names) of the buyer whom purchased the matched (repairer) female to this male...I will always be looking. Maybe she will show up here at another Antique show, at a different seller's table.
There is a big Antique show coming up at the END of the MONTH here. I WILL BE LOOKING FOR HER, and hopefully find her there...... (:fingers_crossed:)
:hb2: :hb2: :hb2:
-
HI Everyone,
From the label alone is very hard to tell.
I have seen the same shape label in old pieces and new pieces (in hanging lamps mostly).
I have seen a few dancer figures that look more like your piece than the 2 blue and white figures you showed in the link. Just looking at the ruffles up the leg and the ruffled base, I dont think it is a Fratelli Toso or Salviati piece.
As for a definite maker, I really do not know.
Javier
-
Awww, Rose! :hug:
It's a mistake we all make at one (or more!) time(s) in our collecting. Many dealers have said to me when I'm hmming about whether to buy a piece or not, "It's the one's you DON'T buy that you regret later, never the ones you DO buy!" And it's usually too true!
Good luck with your search for your poor chap's lady-friend! :-*
-
Same sort of base on the pair on this sale, Rose. Scroll down to item 2961: http://www.dargate.com/249_auction/249_images/249glass.htm
picture here: http://www.dargate.com/249_auction/249_images/2961.jpg
and another pair here with the same bases:
http://www.hoodauction.com/April25/WebSiteFiles/Catalog_1.html (Lot 2)
http://www.hoodauction.com/April25/WebSiteFiles/Catalog_1____1___1.html
-
Hey Ann,
If you look closely at the base of the figure it has a crimped rim all around the base.
That is what I thought was unusual, and didnt think it was an older piece because of it.
Javier
-
Hi Javier, I see what you mean. When you say not an older piece, how old is old? I was looking at the writing on the label which if it's biro (ballpoint pen) has to date from after 1943, and realistically sometime from the 1950s given the retail price of ballpoints in the early days. So would 1950s tie in with your feeling on Rose's piece, or are you feeling later still?
-
Hi Anne
I was going by what the bases on Barovier, Fratelli Toso, Salviati, and Venini pieces look like.
I have never seen a wavy (crimped) base like that, and with the fact that the label could be new also (have seen it on new lamps), that is why I say I thought it was a newer piece, not old. This is based in not having seen that base before. I am thinking maybe 70s as the oldest. Not set in stone of course.
Javier
-
Hi, I thought I would post a copy of extra pixs for this. Any ideas...TIA
-
Hi, I just thought I would add this to my post in reguards to the swirled base of mine, and see what your opinions are. Not only is the base of mine swirled. The base of mine is sort of scalloped which is different -- but the base also has a small white edging around it which is different too.
Here is a *closer look* at the *white edging* on the base of my figurine...
I've then added two links here of figurines with swirled bases (not scalloped like mine though) but you will note the second example here has a small white edging around the base too, which is a bit unusual feature (I think) in the figurines.
http://www.goantiques.com/detail,pair-figurines-archimede,1456131.html (swirled base)
http://www.goantiques.com/detail,pair-figurines-archimede,1456129.html (swirled base w/white edging)
(Added): P.S. I have measured mine, and it is 10.5 inches tall approx.
-
I found some figures on swirled bases here Rose, but can't tell if they're very similar as the site pic is quite small... Fratelli Pitau http://www.italianshop.com.au/clowns2.htm and some on plain bases here... Formia http://www.italianshop.com.au/formia.htm
-
some here too Rose http://www.moltabellaglass.com/catalog/Antiques:Decorative_Art:Glass:Italian.html
-
Thanks for those sites they are most interesting.
The one page http://www.moltabellaglass.com/items/460506/item460506store.html#item the bases are a bit different, but the leaf at the back, the hands, the faces, and edging sure do look similiar to mine...but it is still a hunt I guess.
Thanks for those links :clap:
-
Here is a figurine that does HAVE white around the base edges like the white around the swirled base of mine....but still have not found a swirled base that has scalloped base edges ---YET. :-\ Still looking...
http://www.goantiques.com/detail,pair-figurines-archimede,1456129.html
http://www.goantiques.com/scripts/images,id,1456129.html#image2
-
??? * *..............Could this be some NEW NEWS on a possible maker for this item???
See HERE (http://www.rubylane.com/item/796984-334ss/Venetian-Murano-Glass-Figurine-E) ?? Looks like it has a dot/dash label.....and a label by "E. Vianello S. Marco 364.65 Venezia Italia"
So could this be a possibility of a maker......just throwing it out there.
??
-
More likely a retailer because of the address in St Mark's, Venice
-
** An old 5 year old Post................LOL
Just thought I would throw this out there. Not Sure where they get their info since it has no label - but I thought it was interesting enough to post here.
Found this figurine that reminds me of my red figurine. Base also has some white around it. Face looks similar to mine, IMHO.
~ CLICK HERE ~ (http://www.oldluxe.com/Vintage-Murano-Venetian-Dancer-Barovier-Toso-Glass-Figurine-482.htm?categoryId=-1)
Quoted from the above link ( because SO many links disappear over time):
Vintage Murano Venetian Dancer Barovier Toso, Glass Figurine
Vintage circa. 1950s Murano Venetian dancer by Barovier and Toso, absolutely beautiful the colors are milk white, gold dust and clear glass. In very good vintage condition. Measuring 10 inches in height by a 4 inch base diameter.
Thank you for visiting Old Luxe.
Vintage Murano Venetian Dancer Barovier Toso, Glass Figurine
Just throwing it out there... :-\ ;)
-
I found this Murano glass figurine (http://www.artweshop.com/product/glass-figurine/), could it be made by the same artist?
...beware of fake Murano glass (http://www.artweshop.com/)!
...kaufen Murano glas (http://www.artweshop.com/de/) von einem vertrauten Händler