Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: BJB on September 30, 2006, 05:17:33 PM
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Well. I sure would like to find one of these
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180033115997
Have got it in my watch list to find out the final price!
Its a lovely dish but........................ :shock:
Barbara
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WOW! Still 6 days left. :shock:
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PLEASE try to read 'square' and back what theses bidders on this normally buy - again there seem to be a lot of people just hmmm shift?
JMHO
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ars... : no glass buyings visible
...marko: no glass buyings visible, obviously collector of bottle openers
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positively seen:
thorntriple5 as collector of carnival
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ru..su...
no glass interest so far
please judge yourselves
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Could we be looking at shill bidding here?
Regards,
Marcus
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Sorry, you guys seem to be speaking in code.
What is ru :?: su :?: ars :?:
But the same people seem to be outbidding themselves. Is this what you mean by shilling :?:
Okay, I admit it. I really have no idea about bidding on e-bay. :oops:
Carolyn
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I'm just back from the UK Carnival Glass Convention (which had THE most amazing display of Brockwitz Carnival....ever. More on that in due course).
I can't comment on the bidding for this Dugan "Butterfly & Tulip" bowl, but it has undoubtedly taken a lot of "hits". That is to be expected. It is a rare and lovely item that usually sells for a very healthy price. I've witnessed examples taking $2000 to $3000 at auction in the USA - and I believe exceptional examples have sold for even more.
If you'd like to see the original plunger and mould for this item, it's shown here.
http://www.geocities.com/carni_glass_uk_2000/butterfly_n_tulip.html
Glen
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Here is a great link for this item to help you decide if it is authentic.
Hope this helps you :D
Vintagerose
http://www.ddoty.com/butterflytulip.html
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Here is a great link for this item to help you decide if it is authentic.
Hope this helps you :D
Vintagerose
http://www.ddoty.com/butterflytulip.html
And there was I, mistakenly thinking that's exactly what my article did..........
back to the drawing board and into the corner I go :cry:
Glen
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And there was I, mistakenly thinking that's exactly what my article did..........
It does...... and it is also great to see the actual plunger. :P
Now for maybe a dumb question to you, Glen, but one I am nonetheless going to ask. :oops:
How did they make the seemingly flawless ruffles that decorate the edges of these bowls? I see no tool marks, yet the plunger is as round as a pudding dish.
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Hi Della :D
That's an excellent question - I hope I can give you an answer that will do it justice.
After the plunger had been removed from the hot glass, the bowl would have been "snapped up" - i.e. picked up by its collar base using a tool called a "snaps" (similar to a punty). While hot (very hot) it would have been first shaped (if desired) and then iridised - with a possible visit to the glory hole between times.
Holding the hot bowl by the collar base, using the snaps, the handler would have lowered it onto a specially shaped apparatus that would crimp the edges.
I wrote an article on fine crimp edges (a very tightly ruffled edge) in 1999 that the late Frank Fenton kindly helped me with. He explained it like this (I'll quote him):
"the item is taken up in the snap to be removed from the mould - then, when still hot and malleable, it is pushed down onto the open bottom section of a shaped apparatus known as "the crimp". The top part of "the crimp" (which is hinged in two sections) then closes down onto the piece to form the Fine Crimp edge."
The crimp would have been operated by a foot pedal when Carnival was first made, though Frank told us that later on they "got smarter". A relative, Jim Fenton, developed a way of utilising pneumatic power to operate the apparatus.
You can see some fine crimp edges in this article - plus more on how that particular edge was made.
http://www.carnivalglass.org/education/candy/index.asp
I think I'm right in saying that some shaping would also have been done by hand, and any tool marks could have been fire polished out by returning the item to the glory hole.
Glen
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Thank you for the explanation and the link, Glen. :)
There is also some other great info available there too, which I have been reading. :wink:
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So sorry Glen, didn't mean to make you sad :oops:
VR
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Well, it certainly made a healthy price! :shock:
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It certainly did, and I am pretty sure the bidders were absolutely genuine Carnival Glass dealers/collectors (and no, it was not me - I've got one :shock: )
Glen
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Glen, I hope it was a bargain :wink:
Does anyone know how many were made? For that price they must be as rare as hen's teeth :D
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My Butterfly and Tulip? Well, it has some history. We bought it toward the end of a Carnival Convention in the USA many years ago, from a couple who had decided to sell all their worldly goods and go off into the sunset on a Harley.
We bought it for a reasonable price, but it was still a lot of money. It's a stunning piece. The Butterfly and Tulip bowl may be found in a more pulled up version, but mine (and the one in the eBay auction) is more flared, which shows the pattern very well. Another thing is that the pattern is often sideways on (strictly speaking it is the shaping that is sideways to the pattern) so it does not look quite as magnificent as those (scarcer) examples where the tulip and butterfly are right in the middle, and upright.
It's a big, heavy, imposing piece of glass that's hard to find.
I've no idea how many were made - it's just not possible to come up with those sort of records for Classic carnival. But I can tell you they are very hard to find - and it's even harder to get one with the pattern / flare just right.
Glen
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Glen, that is a wonderful story, and I had no idea that there are good versions as well as bad.
I think glass is like music, when you here a certain song it brings memories flooding back, and its the same when you look at a favourite piece of glass. It brings back so much, sometimes from years ago. There are some bits I would never get rid of, even though my tastes have changed, as they have so much history tied up in them.
Barbara
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as far as I can see from the winner's profile: it's his first purchase of carnival since very long or the first time at all. Normally buying bottle openers and calendars.
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Pamela - the buyer has other eBay IDs. I know exactly who he is - and he buys / deals / collects a lot of Carnival Glass. I've known him for many years - he's absolutely bona fide (and he also collects bottle openers :? )
Glen
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that's good to read and know, Glen. Thank you!
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Can I nominate this topic for archive, for Glen's wonderful description of how the shape was formed.
Cathy