Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: zidori on April 01, 2007, 03:52:13 PM
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This bowl is 4 inches high and 7.5 inches in diametr at the top. It has a spiral ribbon of colour, alternating from blue to green, running from top to base. The base shows the signs of wear associated with age/use and has a sunken pontil.
In Miller Collectables Price guide 2004 (page 299) there is a picture of a Stevens and Williams pink and green rainbow bowl and it makes mention of a blue and green version. Could this be an example?
Ronnie
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-6121
http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-6123
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Ronnie — Yes, it's Stevens & Williams Rainbow, or, more correctly by then, Royal Brierley Rainbow. Popularly dated to the late 1930s, although I've seen no evidence to substantiate this. Most examples are two-colour, a few three-colour. All three S&W / RB pontil finishes — rough, neatly ground, and feature. Some large examples have cut windows, see Dodsworth BGbtW. Some examples are optic moulded.
Best known colour combination is blue/green; best known shape is the posy mushroom.
A collection of as many shapes as you can find is an invaluable resource for learning 1930s RB art glass, otherwise poorly documented and often difficult.
Bernard C. 8)
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Thank you very much Bernard for confirming my tentative guess. I am getting better at these things.
Regards
Ronnie
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Hello Ronnie,
Yes as Bernard says, 1930's and 1950's Royal Brierley. The colourways are: green and blue; green and pink; and blue and pink.
Most have horizontal optic moulding, although there is also a version with a ripple-moulding, similar to that used on Constance Spry pieces that were also made by R/B. Some pieces are cut all over, others have bands of cutting, usually positioned below the rim.
I'm not clear what you mean here though Bernard,
All three S&W / RB pontil finishes — rough, neatly ground, and feature.
Nigel
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Thank you Nigel. At least I was able to track it down this time though I didn't have the confidence or experience to believe myself. Now that I have washed all the car boot grime from it, it is a stunning piece and in excellent condition.
Regards
Ronnie
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... Popularly dated to the late 1930s, although I've seen no evidence to substantiate this. ...
Ronnie & Nigel — Correction, as I have seen evidence. Dodsworth quotes a 1938 pattern number for the example illustrated in BGbtW. As this is a top of the range luxury example with cut windows, it seems reasonable to deduce that Rainbow had been around for a while, but, as always, by how long? — six months, a decade — who can tell?
Nigel — Have you seen evidence for post-war production of Rainbow? You suggested 1950s. How about the late 1940s? I recall Adam telling us that in the late '40s Sowerby could sell everything they made; in fact they had trouble keeping up with the demand. Was there a similar boom further south?
By feature I meant a de-luxe re-shaped base, with all trace of a pontil scar completely gone. I have actually displayed such items upside down on my stand as the bases are so superb. Have you any idea of the S&W/RB name for this finish? Was it an optional extra, or did they just do it automatically for their classiest clients?
Bernard C. 8)
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...in the late '40s Sowerby could sell everything they made; in fact they had trouble keeping up with the demand. Was there a similar boom further south?
The following PG editorial hints at the issues creating the 'boom', seemingly more to do with inefficiencies and bureaucratic interference. Text courtesy glass-study.com .
NEW YEAR GREETINGS
To all our friends in the pottery and glass trades, whether they be manufacturers, wholesalers, retailers, engineers, transfer or colour makers, we send best wishes for a successful and prosperous New Year. May 1950 be a year of continued full employment, though less harassed by the difficulties of 1949.
It may be that many of the problems prevalent in 1949 will remain in 1950. It had been hoped (in some quarters it had even been prophesied) that before the old year was out some of the restrictions on the home market would have been relaxed. But it was not to be. Exhortations to export more and more came regularly from the Board of Trade and the Chancellor of the Exchequer. Devaluation brought renewed and intensified demands. Generally speaking, potters and glassmakers responded loyally to the call, while the great majority of retailers, with admirable and patient fortitude, sighed, shrugged their shoulders and prepared themselves for yet another period of trading with drab-looking shelves and showcases. They have had to put up with much. They sometimes grumble, but they undoubtedly understand.
The prospects for 1950 are not easy to assess. Mr. Harold Wilson's report on his return from his American trip does not indicate any early relaxation of restrictions on the sale of decorated ware at home.
“BEEFS” FOR LUNCH
We have seen a circular which has apparently been distributed in this country by a Canadian contemporary, The Gift Buyer. It bears the droll title: “We Get Canadian 'Beefs' for Lunch.” With customary North American vigour, it tells of a speech made at a luncheon table by an anonymous Canadian distributor of pottery and glass, In effect, the circular hits at British pottery manufacturers in general, and at an un-named one in particular.
When one has sorted the wheat from the chaff, it is found that the un-named British manufacturer will be eight months behind with his delivery schedule this month. The Gift Buyer remarks that the Canadian organisation is “fed-to-the-teeth with having to put up with what they consider to be 'Business Nonsense'.”
Adding fuel to the fire, the circular mentions a letter alleged to have been received from the British potter. We quote:
“Yesterday (October 31) he (the Canadian speaker) got a letter from the same factory (believe it or not!) which now tells him that the wares won't be here for Christmas, but if all goes well ('and you must understand the terrific difficulties the potteries are working under at this time ') the distributor will probably get his shipments some time in January.”
If the original intention was to circulate this story in Canada only, it seems a sure way of undermining confidence in British pottery there, particularly when it opens with a reference to “Alien pottery, back stamped 'U.S. Occupied Territory'.” Canadian readers of this Journal are kept well informed of the true situation here in the British potteries. We are producing to capacity, and as more and more mechanisation is introduced production will rise in proportion. Agitation in the form of literature which pours scorn and imprecations on the hard-working pottery manufacturer and his operatives in Britain is not helpful. The speaker at the luncheon quoted should come to Britain and see the situation for himself. Potters would welcome the opportunity to show him round and if he turns up on the right day he may get real beef for lunch.
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Hello,
Fair point Bernard, by putting 1950's, I was indicating that there was a progression between pre and post-war production that would have included a short period within the late 1940's. The evidence for this continuation of "Rainbow" ware was found by Jeanette Hayhurst some years ago and was particularly relevant if exhibiting at the NEC when it had a 1940 dateline for glass (it's currently 1950).
As for the pontil finishing. Since you have described the pontil as re-shaped I am assuming that you are referring to a wide, well polished, concave pontil that covers virtually the whole of the base?
There seems to be some consistancy as to the type of pontil that is used for a given series of wares, however, just as with other manufacturers, there are idiosyncracies that have, to date, not been explained. Your hypothosis that there may have been a particular finish for the more pricey items may well be right, but, since there have not been enough items placed together to give this credance, it is difficult to make any positive conclusion.
For instance, I have just bought a Keith Murray designed decanter by Royal Brierley that has a flat base. It is likely that this would have been an expensive item, but it doesn't have the 'deluxe'/ re-shaped pontil that you refer to. Most likely this would be because the flat base was more apt for the item in question.
The same variations between standard pontil, wide pontil, concave pontil covering the base, and flat base, occur across cut glass by S&W/RB. Standard and wide pontils occur within the art glass ranges, with occasional use of the style I have assumed you are referring to, which cover most of the base. Perhaps, at this stage, it is unwise to make any hard and fast 'rule(s)-of-thumb' concerning the finishing of S&W/RB's work, rather take note that a number of finishes were employed - making it a joy (or a chore) to diagnose!!
Nigel
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See topic Stevens & Williams Vase? (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,42704.0.html) for further discussion and images of several types of the S&W/RB Rainbow range, including both horizontally and vertically (ribbed) optic moulded examples.
Bernard C. 8)
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Did Stevens and Williams do a rainbow effect vase with bubbles please?
many thanks
m
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Can I ask for clarification of the colour issue on this thread with regard to the Rainbow range please? I'm wondering if, since this thread is from 2007, that knowledge or information on the colours may have changed in the intervening time.
But on here Bernard says
' Most examples are two-colour, a few three-colour. '
Nigel has said
'The colourways are: green and blue; green and pink; and blue and pink.' , which doesn't seem to indicate a three colour-way option.
And I have seen one id'd as Stevens and Williams with a horizontal optic ribbed barrel shaped body and with what appears to be 4 colours rainbow effect, pink,green,blue and purple.
I have also just bought a vase that I thought might be Stevens and Williams that may have a three colour rainbow effect and with bubbles, although since it hasn't arrived yet I can't tell whether or not it really might be Stevens and Williams, but I thought I'd start investigating anyway when I came upon this thread.
Any thoughts would be very helpful :)
Many thanks
m
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I put a nice S&W pink and green Rainbow bowl on ebay a few weeks ago start 25 quid not one bid , i relisted @19.99 still no bid ,a nice neat pontil about the size of a two bob bit!!!! .i also have a vase ,,,, dont think i will bother .
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JP they are gorgeous pieces of glass. Just not the right time for them maybe at the moment? Do you happen to know if they did this rainbow in bubble effect please?
m
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I have had this S & W vase for some time. It was very badly water stained and it is half way through a polishing (it takes days !!or weeks in my case) but thought it would add to this thread. It is 22cm in height. It has a lot of wear on the outer ring of the base and is the term Ground and polished right for this piece ? I was led to believe it was 1930's-ish. (If I ever finish polishing it it would look great)
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Nice shape Pete. How much does it weigh as a matter of interest? I have one S&W 30's vase cloudy,and it weighs an absolute ton.
m
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It is a substantial weight. 1.995kg. I paid 2 as it had such bad water marks and the lad I bought it from seemed to know his stuff with a varied collection for sale, it is his opinion for the date. He seemed know their worth. (I checked ;D) There are now only the scratch marks to go. Its fine powder for next few attempts and then a final polish.
I have never understood why some bases are rough or in my opinion, unfinished. They have the tools to the job at hand and it does make a difference to any piece. Glass should look good from all angles.
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Hi M i have never seen a bubbly one only the two and three coloured ones,,, no bubbles and have i been around a long time ?!!!!dont answer that , law of averages i would have seen or heard if there had been one .
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Interesting. There is one here - suppose it might not really be part of the 'rainbow' range :-\
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stevens-Williams-of-Stourbridge-C1930s-Cylindrical-Bubble-Vase-20cm-Tall-/230814609649?pt=UK_Art_Glass&hash=item35bd9f70f1
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Nice price too :o
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I like that , nice one .
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so is that a consensus yes to it being Stevens and Williams, or yes to it being a bubbly Rainbow range Stevens and Williams? or just it's a nice piece? Mine is like this but I think it might be three colours 8)
m
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I have no idea who made it but i like it , far nicer than my bowl and vase . :-\
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I've seen one identified by Fieldings Auctioneers as Stevens and Williams.
m
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and just to add, having relooked at my pictures again mine is three colours plus clear and it also has 'CELERY' etched onto the vase.
Steven makes a comment here about the fact a vase has Celery etched onto it dating it to early post-war.
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,30793.msg167022.html#msg167022
Would it be feasible to assume having the word CELERY etched onto gives it some age and that it dates to the 40's perhaps?
Ok scrub that... having just looked it up it seems Purchase Tax was introduced in 1940 on amongst other things luxury good and abolished in 1971 when VAT was introduced. So I can assume the vase probably dates to between 1940 and 1971.
m