Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => Scandinavian Glass => Topic started by: SCANDIMAD on December 04, 2010, 03:21:02 PM
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I recently had the good fortune of buying this monumental piece of Nils Landberg Expo blown glass from a wonderful German eBayer. What I am trying to ascertain is who the engraver was who completed this incredible piece of work. As you can see by the pictures I have listed here the vase is indeed truely monumental, standing just over 13" tall and 9" wide and fully marked to the base which reads - ORREFORS EXPO. N. 3776. D8. BB - As far as I can make out from the marks it is BB at the end and not BG for the engraver Bertil Gustavesson, so my question is does anybody have an opinion as to who this engraver with the initials BB was? Any help would be great. SCANDIMAD
http://jpegbay.com/gallery/000747247-.html
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Wow! What a great vase. I can't help with your BB - but I am jealous.
Ross
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Great vase. According to the numbers you provide, The Orrefors book edited by Wickman says that this was designed in 1962 and made in 1968. However, I don't see a "BB" for an engraver. Any other possible letters?
David
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D8 =1969
Engraver :
B
BE
BG
BH
Only Bertil Gustafsson of these worked at OF 1969.
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Daniel is correct about 1969; I mistyped. Daniel, are you able to distinguish between different engravers? Does this seem to be the work of a more experienced engraver?
David
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please provide a pic of the signature, will be easier for sure.
The engraver should be pretty experienced. This is a EXPO piece, that means limited edition. OF wanted to show off good stuff.
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Hi Daniel
Thanks very much for your input, today I did get an e-mailed reply from Orrefors, which states the piece was a limited edition in 1969 however they have not elaborated on how many were produced, and yes the engraver was Bertil Gustavssen. I've tried to download a few more pictures with reference of the marks involved on the base of the vase. I must just say though "Bertil" has really shown his talent as an glass engraver, when you really look at this piece in close up it does not take long to realise it is truly wondrous piece of art from a real master of his trade. How would you price a piece such as this? I've really got to think about this because if anything it needs to go on my contents insurance. Regards Den
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Here are a few other pictures of the actual marks of this superb vase. Thanks for your help and interest guys!
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As you will probably see in the last picture of the 4 i've posted, what I beleived was possibly another "B" on the end could well be a very stylised "G" making it BG for Bertil Gustavssen.
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That looks like BG to me as well.
Well it's hard to tell exactly how many expo pieces that were made. If it sold bad few were made.
My grandfather who was a boss att OF once said that 250 pieces was a common number.
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Hi Daniel
I've heard of a limited edition of between 1 - 100 pieces regarding EXPO, but never 250.
A vase of this size and dimensions would surely be restricted as to the amount produced simply because of the work involved in it production, to produce this particular vase in any great quality or quantity would need at least 350+ vase's blown before going on to be engraved. This figure is only based on the amount of pieces discarded because of slight imperfections in the blowing process i.e minute air bubbles, carbon deposits and flow lines etc. Simply because of Orrefors own quality ethics came in to play a lot of pieces were discarded before going even further down the process line.
Also many delicate pieces never made it passed the engravers wheel, as flaws in the glass caused many fragile pieces to brake up while being engraved.
This particular engraving is quite immense in size, and even with the use of outline template which were used as well as many other templates for intricate and highly detailed pieces the work and time involved in this vases production would limit the amount of pieces created. The very limited editions were completed freehand by the engravers, even then some pieces worked out to be so time consuming their batch totals were cut short mid flow because their production became economically unviable. A lot of the engravers were journey men and so being were paid on the amount of pieces they finished, and unlike the designers they would only sign off on pieces they were personally satisfied with just like any good artist worth his salt would. Like in any field of work the engravers had their elite craftsman and these men demanded higher fees, from their employers.
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I'm sorry but 1-100 pieces is not enough.
Please remember that engraved pieces were only one part of the total expo production.
But like I wrote earlier, some of the pieces were only made in 20 examples or so.
They didn't have a 50% discard rate, less than that. I have been working at OF myself and also tried to both engrave and cut.
I know for sure that many engravers were employed at Orrefors for a long time.
Some pieces take a long time to engrave, some less. Yes templates have been used, that's what I tried with myself. Still found it very hard. :-)
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Hi Daniel
Sorry my friend after reading your reply beforehand I assumed you were telling me that this particular vase was made in a quantity of 250 pieces. I had not realised you were actally talking about an intire EXPO run, I was told previously the EXPO run was made up of different designs from all the designers working within the factory at that particular time of any one year.
I was lead to beleive that each designer employed within Orrefors at the time, and that could have been as many as 15 to 20 designers at any one time, were asked to produce 25 examples of the design line they were working on. And although they had to be the same design they could vary in size if in deed they were actually produced in different sizes the same rule applied for different colours and also Artist engraved or not engraved depending on who the designer was. That would then mean that there would be a grand total of between 375 - 500 individual pieces produced under the EXPO label at any one time, with a very minamal minority of those pieces being identical.
A very good friend of mine the award winning glass artist Steve Bradly, who has his own glass blowing business in the West Country here in England told me this many years ago, and that information was again confirmed by another family friend and glass artist Max Lamb, some years later.
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I'm sorry but that information is not accurate.
Orrefors have had several designers hired=agreed.
Expo pieces started to appear around 1944. The first production consisted of experiments, old 'never in production' pieces and mainly artglass pieces made for exhibitions.
From 44-75 approx 3800 EXPO models were made.
For example No 312-57, a common Tulip glass by Landberg, made in several hundred possibly thousands.
Landberg and Palmqvist together designed approx half of the grand total. Hald, Lundin, Öhrström and Selbing made the rest.
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When you mention 25 pieces you probably think of the Gallery production. It first appeared during the early 80's. Each artist had one or several designs in a special catalogue. Some of the listed items in these catalogues were made in 25-50 editions. For example, 1984, 13 artists had designs in the that catalogue. But that also included non working like Sven Palmqvist and Simon Gate.
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Feel free to ask any questions. As mentioned before my grandfather worked there for 37 years, he held a major position.
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Hello Daniel
Firstly allow me to thank you for taking the time out and corresponding with me on this subject, I really do appriciate it. And I am greatful to you for giving me an insite into the daily workings of the Orrefors Factory.
Getting back to the subject of this vase of mine, taking everything on board of what you have detailed regarding Expo pieces, do you think or now this vase was made in any great numbers, I only ask because after 22 years of dedicated collecting from all over the world this is the first vase of its type that I have ever come across, not only because of its grand scale but also because of the quality of the engraved design by Gustavssen.
Hopefully next year all going well I would like to visit Sweden and the Orrefors factory, I have always put it off because of my business here in England. Because I have always championed their creative work and each individual glass artist who has devoted their working lives to the factory name, I think its on the list of "must do! before I die"! Things.
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I'm very glad to help if I can. Sometimes these glass terms are hard for me to translate to good English. So if you don't understand just ask again.
You are probably right concerning your piece. The exact quantaties are to my knowledge not researchable. In this case my guess would be that feew were made. With that I mean 20-50 pcs.
Today at OF and any other glassworks the engravers are very few, most place don't have anyone.
If you like engraved pieces you are lucky, not many do and they are easy and affordable to collect. Especially the mid to low end stuff.
At the OF factory you will be able to look at the glass blowing hall, no other parts are open to visitors.
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Daniel:
Just to add my thanks for your explanations of the Expo and Gallery process. I think I have a far better understanding know than I got from looking at numbers in a book. Your knowledge and patience is very much appreciated.
Scandimad: I'm not a collector of engraved glass, but the quality on this piece is very impressive. I just don't see that quality on any of the Orrefors pieces I come across. It's a piece I would treasure, perhaps not so much for its economic value, but for the quality of its workmanship and rarity. The only engraving currently being done of that quality that I have seen is by individuals in studio glass whose works is very expensive.
Thanks for sharing it with us.
David
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Hi David
Glad you like the piece, I've been collecting Orrefors for over 22 year now and not just engraved items and I'm still finding pieces now and again that astound me in the way they were produced and worked on by particular designers and artist engravers alike. The engraving on this particular vase is simply breath taking when you consider its all the result of one mans work on a copper engraving wheel. It isn't that there was a production line of wheel engraver who completed a section and then it was passed onto the next engravers bench and so on. The finished engraved picture was completed by one single artist which in this case was Bertil Gustavssen. I can never imagine in these days that there is a glass engraver who would even contemplate starting, let alone finishing a piece of this grand nature and quality. Some of the cuts involved on this engraving would have to be judged within a thousandth of an inch, one slip and it would all be over. Can you imaging just handling and maneuvering this piece with its great size up to and against the cutting edge of the spinning copper wheel for any length on time, it weighs in access of 4.5kg and the walls of the vase are not the thickest I've seen on a vase this size. All together it tremendous workmanship and definitely something to behold.
Any way David, where in Canada are you based, I only ask because I have close relatives who are now long term naturalised Canadians living there in places just outside Toronto on the lakeside of Lake Ontario, my close cousin Mike and his family live in a place called Unionville, Markham. And more on the West Coast near Vancouver, one has a peach grove up in the Rockies, and another has a boat building business in Whale Town on an island called Cortes, in Vancouver bay.
Regards Den