Glass Message Board
Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. => British & Irish Glass => Topic started by: Paul S. on May 11, 2011, 09:39:02 PM
-
I'm sure the experts are very much aware of the following, and hope they don't find this too boring (much of which has been said before, of course). Apparently Webb called this particular surface pattern '
Venetian Ripple' 'horizontal wave' [see replies 16/17] (this piece measures about 7" x 7"), and for me, I see it on my travels as the most common finish after 'Old English Bull's Eye'. Surprisingly, I have yet to find a 'Plain' finished piece, and I guess the remaining finish, the 'Water Lily' design, is the most uncommon. Also, surprisingly, I've yet to find a piece of either 'Spring (a delicate shade of green akin to Eau-de-nil, apparently), or 'Evergreen' (a darker sort of Bristol Green) - why should this be so - were the 'greens' unpopular, or made in vastly lesser quantities?? If you read H. W. Woodward's book he unfortunately confuses the colour issue with regard to 'Amber' and 'Sunshine Amber', and refers to both simply as... "Sunshine" (golden amber), without making the distincton between those pieces containing uranium (Sunshine Amber) and the non uranium examples (Golden Amber) - and whilst the latter former [ * ] are perhaps the less common variety, they do exist in reasonable numbers. There is no doubt that Woodward's book is of much value, since there is almost nothing else of reference on Webb (apart from some data in Charles R. Hajdamach, and Roger Dodsworth's 'British Glass Between The Wars') - but his four and a quarter lines on 'Gay' glass is paltry to say the least (and lacking a single illustration to boot). We could do with someone producing something weighty on Webb. Picture four is, of course, 'Golden Amber' (non uranium) - which you will all know, which seems to be a hue given to quite noticeable variation in depth of colour. Does anyone know if this particular bowl is a common pattern, or scarce?? - I'm sure I haven't seem an example previously.
References: 'Art, Feat And Mystery (The Story of Thomas Webb & Sons, Glassmakers) - H. W. Woodward - 1978.
20th Century British Glass - Charles R. Hajdamach - Antique Collectors Club 2009.
'British Glass Between the Wars' - Roger Dodsworth (Editor) - 1987
[ * ] Mod: edited in accordance with later comment by Paul.
-
Paul, I too have been frustrated in my search for information about Webb's 'Gay Glass'! Did you see the thread about my Sunshine Amber bowl? http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,37484.0.html I can't help wondering if mine was a plain piece which was subsequently engraved, as the design isn't mentioned in any references I've found to Gay Glass.
Doesn't Christine have a piece in 'Spring' green, I seem to remember? I'm sure she's the person who would have it if anyone did! ;) ;D
-
She has, but only the one http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,39715.0.html
-
I had just typed my reply and it was crossing with Christines post, so I have deleted a small part, but otherwise will let it stand :)
""thanks Leni - and yes, I did see your link re your cut 'Sunshine Amber' bowl - you added it to one of my posts a couple of weeks back :) - and I see that my - slightly flippant - post remains the final comment, so guess you are still waiting to get some closure on the origins of your cutting. Suddenly got to thinking, now that I have a number of pieces in 'Bulls Eye and one or two pieces in 'Ripple', how absent the other colours/finishes are. Yours may well have been a plain example, subsequently given the cutting treatment - trouble is that you may well never know for certain.
I believe also that David Encell is very keen on Webb's glass - and makes me wonder if he might well have some - I would like to buy Keith's example, and Christine's please :ooh: Nonetheless very annoying that these 'greens' are so difficult to come by, but I can't be left out, and will now look doubly hard.
Would be nice to see something in a printed format showing the full range of patterns - alwasy nice when you are a collector - shows how near you are getting to completing a collection - trouble then is that you will need another cabinet :24:""
-
David certainly has Ripple mushroom posies in Spring Green and Sunshine amber and a Sunshine Amber Ripple tumbler (I've still got the pix he sent me). Perhaps he'll add to this when he's available.
-
I'm reviving this thread, because yesterday at 'Reflect' I was lucky enough to find this piece. It's 'Water Lily', engraved on 'Bullseye'! :D
The clever bit (not sure if it's obvious from my photograph) is that every Water Lily and every leaf is cleverly engraved exactly on a 'bullseye' :hiclp:
I'm a very happy bunny! :girlcheer: :smg:
-
:cry: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
-
thought for a moment you said 'Relate'....... :24: But seriously, truly great piece, and I think we are all very happy for you (no, we're not really, like Keith I'm green as hell and wish I'd found it). In fact for me it's possibly the greens that seem to put in the least appearance, although do now have two or three pieces - but am still a little confused re classifying this particular colour - especially as there appear to be possibly three kinds. Two of these are in the Gay Range...........Spring (Eau-di-nil) and Evergreen (Old Bristol Green), and then perhaps just an ordinary green like this one. But Anyway, a wonderful piece, and where is it by the way that you go collecting ;)
-
This is Spring (aka eau de nil); Leni forgot to say it was uranium. I suspect that the non-uranium green of this shade was also known as Spring; the punters wouldn't have known it didn't contain uranium.
-
Leni forgot to say it was uranium.
:pb: :-[ Indeed she did! ::) Very definitely Uranium! ;D
-
thanks :)
-
Hi Paul,
I came across your post here while trying to find out more about a sundae dish I have. I hope you don't mind me asking your opinion.
I wondered if you know if this is a "Sunshine Amber" dish by Thomas Webb?
Your vase looks the same colour (which if like this, can look completely amber or half green depending on the light) but I've not been able to find a plain glass sweet dish like it.
Do you know if there any pattern books it maybe listed in?
-
It's a grapefruit dish. I also have one. Webb wasn't the only company to make this sort of colour. Walsh Walsh did too.
-
Thank you Lustroustone! I never would've thought it a grapefruit dish, I was thinking along more unhealthy lines of ice creams and sundaes :) I thought Webb wouldn't be the only works to make this colour but they were all I could find. Did Walsh make this do you know? I'd guess around 1920/30 ish??
-
hi - Christine is far more knowledgeable on these things than me, so appreciate the reply Christine. Sorry to be thick sendhandfran, but I take it you're saying your dish is uranium - would appear both of your pix have been taken in daylight, and not using a u.v. torch.
Often, when exposed to morning sunshine, the short wave length light rays will make the uranium react quite strongly - gives a nice glow on the edges.
My rather uneducated guess is that your dish is not sufficiently 'amber' to be T/Webb's Sunshine Amber from their Gay Glass range - but no doubt Christine will put us right.
Easy to tell if you have a grapefruit dish, as opposed to a general purpose desert dish - the base has turned up outer edges which provide somewhere safe to put your pips - saves spitting them out. ;)
I'm sure that sundaes are always tall and cone shaped, but perhaps I'm wrong.
P.S. If you look at the Board's archive section 'Library of Thomas Webb Colours', am sure you'll find plenty of examples of T.W. material with which you can at least compare colours.
I could be wrong, but have an idea that Walsh pieces relating to this shape and colour have an iridescent finish, so will have a different type of surface appearance.
-
Walsh used their sunshiney amber for other finishes other than irridescent, including over white as a "primrose"
-
Hi,
Can I ask where the name 'Venetian Ripple' for the original item featured in the is thread comes from please? It's just that I thought this pattern was called something different and Venetian Ripple referred to another.
Many thanks, Nigel
-
it's late Nigel so I will spend time on this tomorrow a.m. hopefully - for the time being, and without investigating the three references I quoted in that first post, I am assuming it came from one of them - let's hope that is confirmed tomorrow. :)
back again Nigel - the name V.R. occurs in C.H. '20th Century Glass', but it's not linked to an illustration in that book, and it does look as though I've made a wrong assumption in associating it with the design you refer to, which I believe is correctly 'horizontal wave'. V.R. is a legitimate design, and is apparently an alternative name for 'heavy pillar mould' - a pattern shown in C.H. 'British Glass 1800 - 1914' - and very dissimilar to horizontal wave.
thanks for pointing out my error - much appreciated - and perhaps the Mods. can correct my mistake when convenient. :) [Mod: Initial post corrected]
-
Many thanks for the reply Paul.