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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 11:16:43 AM

Title: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 11:16:43 AM

Red Thumb Bowl with optic windows, 45mm high, what looks like a ground out pontil to a pressed glass base?, but the rest of the item certainly doesn't looked like pressed glass?
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: chopin-liszt on November 29, 2012, 12:41:03 PM
That's a ground out pontil mark - the "pressed" appearance of the base will be from it being flattened on the marver.
The marver is the metal "table" the glass is worked on.

A pontil (iron) is the long iron rod the glass is held on while being worked. When it is broken off, it leaves a pontil mark. To say a bit of glass has a pontil actually measn it's still stuck on the iron.
Sorry for being a grumpy old pedant!

This is rather a nice thing - but I'm again, clueless as to what it might be.  :)
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 12:44:22 PM
Hi Sue,

Many thanks, I know about pontils but now you mention the marver it makes sense!

Cheers
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Lustrousstone on November 29, 2012, 12:50:46 PM
The matt base grinding with the polished windows imply very modern homeware to me; it's not a sign of quality. Do you really mean 45 mm high?
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 01:02:56 PM
Hi Christine,

It's actually 55mm, my ruler has a 1 cm gap before the measurements start!

Thanks for the info,


Steve
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Paul S. on November 29, 2012, 02:55:11 PM
for me it's the manufacturing processes that I sometimes struggle to understand - although I do know that the pontil rod is used to hold the piece whilst additional hot working is done etc.             I also know what is meant by the pontil scar and ground/polished pontil depression.            Obviously, as far as cutting goes, this is done when cold.
This piece looks an obvious candidate for being plunger pressed - so might the reason for having had a pontil attachment be because after pressing the rim needed to be fire polished.
Or am I wrong completely and was this a blown item which started life on the end of a blow-pipe, then rolled roughly to shape on the marver and then blown - to be subsequent transferred to the rod to finish the rim??         Just that to my ignorant eyes it didn't look like a piece of blown glass.
Sorry to be dim, and am sure one of you clever people can help me :)

By the way, what is a 'thumb' bowl??
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 03:00:53 PM
Hi Paul, many thanks for the insight,

The term thumb bowl is a description I've attributed to the item having seen thumb bowls in pottery where the bowl literally has enough room for two thumbs back to back, having used the thumbs to form the indent,

Cheers
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Paul S. on November 29, 2012, 04:18:55 PM
hello :)      quote    "many thanks for the insight"  -  to be honest Retro, I think it's me that's looking for the insight ;D
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 04:42:43 PM
Lol!

I find it fascinating hearing the thought process on identification and the roots of a piece  :)
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: chopin-liszt on November 29, 2012, 04:56:01 PM
While Lustrousstone was looking at the way it's been finished, (or rather, the lack of work finishing it) I was thinking more of the trouble it takes to polish all those lenses.

I also thought your "Thumb vase" was a descriptor of the lenses - as places to put your thumbs when holding it.  ;)
It is very small - could it be a tea-light holder? (not my sort of area - I don't do candles)
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Retro Mojo UK on November 29, 2012, 05:06:59 PM
Hi Sue,

This is why it interested me, it's a good weight and feel and a bit of work has gone into it. It's most definitely not for a tea light though. It's quite thick walled and well cut lenses and a clean, smooth rim. The fact it's got a pontil polished out must mean that someone hand worked it?

Cheers
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Paul S. on November 29, 2012, 07:10:24 PM
despite my limited knowledge of processes, I am aware that ground/polished pontil depressions can appear on both pressed and blown glass - although at a guess I suppose this feature appears more commonly on blown glass.          I had assumed from Sue's comments that it was being implied this item had been blown (marvered whilst on the end of the the blow-pipe etc.) - I really don't know - but just thought it didn't look like a piece of blown glass - too thick maybe.         I'm sure I know less than Sue about glass production.
The end use of some pieces of glass can be surprising - see the attached pic..........I now know what this small clear piece (it's about 2.5" - 65mm tall) was intended for, but see how many of you can also guess it's purpose, although again I don't know whether it was pressed or blown.   It does have a ground/polished potil depression  -  think I'd have needed a lot of guesses before getting to the correct answer - maybe not though if I were a mason :)
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: chopin-liszt on November 29, 2012, 07:15:01 PM
Polishing the lenses would have been hand done, I'm sure, but the pontil mark (also hand worked) has only been roughly ground. A good quality thing is far more likely to have had the pontil mark properly polished all shiney bright. (I'm glad I only had to type that. I'd have trouble saying it!)
(Getting away from my areas of comfort again - I like studio glass - hot worked stuff. I'm not nearly so much into any sort of cold working on glass.)

Paul, your thing looks like a tiny tumbler.
I would not even wish to hazard a guess about what masons might do with anything.   :P
My geography teacher told us all about the picture of a huge triangular eye she was scared of in a toilet.
It had the words; "God thou see-est always." written underneath. Why "God" would wish to watch somebody in the loo is beyond me. I'm sure that was something masonic!
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: Paul S. on November 29, 2012, 07:31:04 PM
I'm not playing this game any more  -  no one ever seems to have trouble in id ing my pieces.       I'm told by a mason (those with rolled up trouser legs - not users of cold chisels) that it's a firing glass from the first third of the C20 - from a Worcestershire lodge.    I had thought you might have stood pencils in it. ;)
Title: Re: Red Thumb bowl with optic windows
Post by: chopin-liszt on November 29, 2012, 07:38:39 PM
That would seem logical Paul, given the illustration on it - dividers and a set square. Pencil case stuff.
I told you you can't trust those peculiar men in pinnies.  ;)