Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Topic started by: JasonHamilton on February 24, 2018, 01:57:00 AM
-
This stunning compote came out of a large glass collection of old fine glass, dating back to 1847. Pieces consisted of Murano (heavy on Murano), Scandanavian (Sweden/Finland), and English (Corbett Webb Agate Flambe) Most pieces are cataloged already but this one is a mystery. Pictures don't do the colors justice. Has applied red canes and pink opaque glass with a clear glass base. Looks like a Morning Glory. I was referred by other collectors to post this here. Any information on this piece would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
5" Tall
6" Wide
-
The effect (but not with the red stripes) reminds me of the effect of Monot Stumpf glass.
m
-
;D
I know of Stumpf, Touvier and Violette, but not of Monot Stumpf. ???
I have a tiny ST&V salt. this piece does remind me of those colourways, m, without the red stripe, but the piece posted looks much more thickly made. My guts have a feeling this might be newer, and emulating those older styles?
My guts may be completely off-target. ;D
-
Maybe Italian given the canes?
You may be right Sue. It was just a thought, that was what it reminded me of. Just to give a start on where to search first perhaps?
m
-
Definitely that sort of direction. :)
That opalescent pink and mix of colours to produce something so attractive requires a competent maker, whoever it is and when ever it was made. I just feel it doesn't quite have the delicacy of antique glass.
Is there any uranium glass present in it? That will glow bright green with UV light.
An interesting piece for your first post, JasonHamilton! Welcome to the board. :)
-
I haven't check on the uranium glass. I'll get a black light today. Thanks so much for your interest. The collection this came out of had some extremely rare valuable pieces. I'll let you know on the uranium.
-
I have several extremely rare and valuable pieces; I also have a lot of rubbish. ;D
When collecting, you need to find your way through the rubbish to find the good stuff, learning as you go.
We don't start out buying only the top stuff, we don't know enough to be able to judge.
This is a very interesting piece and it is well made. If I'd seen it somewhere, I may well have bought it, just for the interest. :)
-
If it were Monot & Stumpf im almost certain on a piece this size it would have the concave polished finish pontil. Nice piece though.
-
yes, was more thinking of the era though.
m
-
So I ran across this piece doing some online research. I know this is just throwing it out there, but the cane work, thickness of the glass does remind me of Seguso's work. Here's just an example. Maybe somethingv to go on. What do you think?
Mod: Images removed as per Board policy on copyrighted material. See reply #11 for link to web page.
-
:) They could easily be related, couldn't they?
I know nothing about Italian glass. I can do "oohs" and "aaahs" but that's about it. ;D
I'm going to sit back and see if I can learn. :)
-
So I ran across this piece doing some online research. I know this is just throwing it out there, but the cane work, thickness of the glass does remind me of Seguso's work. Here's the link.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.1stdibs.com/amp/furniture/decorative-objects/bowls-baskets/decorative-bowls/archimede-seguso-murano-green-rods-gold-flecks-italian-art-glass-bowl/id-f_6036533/
Might be something to go on?
-
Two different eras to my eye. Your comport lookslike it could be Webb Lemonescent, think it matches the vase mrvaselineglass posted about here:
https://www.glassmessages.com/index.php?topic=4639.0
Group photo here, especially the photo bottom right: http://www.vaselineglass.org/lemonescenttrio.jpg
John
-
ooh good spot and memory John!
I perceived it very differently photographed on a black background.
m
-
John!! You did it! The vase in the link is a spot on match to the compote! Just went to the site and it's absolutely Vaseline glass. Looks to be possibly the Victorian era. Now I need black light and to find out the artist. I have 0 knowledge on Vaseline glass! Outstanding work John! Thank you!
-
Jason could you please post a photograph of it against a plain white background?
I would really love to see what the piece looks like in daylight without the effect the black background makes to it.
Thank you.
m
-
Sure. I'll post a few up here in just a few min.
-
Thank you so much.
m
-
Here you go. :)
-
I think I might of figured it out. I believe it's an English piece by John Walsh, Victorian era.??
-
It looks remarkably like the ones John posted Jason.
Do you have a reference source for thinking it is by Walsh Walsh please?
and thank you for the extra pictures - much appreciated.
m
-
WOW! Guess it's Vaseline glass.
-
Much more likely to be Webb (though I don't think that is Lemonescent even though Dave says it is; the recipe has nothing in it to go pink for a start) as John suggests than Walsh Walsh. Their glass is usualy much thinner for a start. I too would like to know where you got your Walsh reference from
-
Yes I wondered about Dave's attribution of Lemonescent for his vase too, no doubt now that the compote and vase will share the same maker.
-
I think Dave's attribution came from Manley but although, Cyril had a wonderful collection, we now know many of his attributions are less than wonderful
-
Yes your correct. I have found through Vaseline glass experts that this piece is Thomas Webb and sons, not John Walsh.
.
-
"vaseline" is an american term. It refers, I believe, specifically to uranium glass that also has opalescent glass in it, hence its similarity in colour and semi-opacity to a pot of petroleum jelly.
So it is not a term that covers all uranium glass. It can lead to a lot of confusion.
-
Good thing I'm American
-
Actually vaseline glass refers only to yellow uranium glass (unless you are in Australia). Petroleum jelly, aka Vaseline, was actually very yellow before it got so purified
-
Vaseline glass is a recent term that probably dates from the 1950s. Uranium glass, an older and more general term, is sometimes used as a synonym for Vaseline glass, but this can lead to confusion because some types of glass colored with uranium (e.g., custard glass and Burmese glass) are opaque whereas Vaseline glass is transparent. Canary glass is an even older name that was first used in the 1840s to describe what is now referred to as Vaseline glass.
-
Aah. I got my description from Jo Marshall's "Glass Source" book. It's quite old and just a "general" sort of book. Possibly not the most accurate. :)
I just avoid the use of the term because it's not very useful and as it turns out, I still got it wrong despite being aware of it. ;D
-
Vaseline is just a US collector's term and can include transparent yellow glass with opalescence. It is all uranium glass be it yellow, green, blue, amber, pink, etc. in varying degrees of transparency or even opacity The oldest terms are anagelb and anagrun and were devised by the German inventor of uranium glass. If you refer to it as uranium glass, you are not going to be wrong.
Everything thing in this album contains at least some uranium glass and has all passed through my hands, though some of it has left. http://lustrousstone.co.uk/cpg/thumbnails.php?album=1
-
thank goodness that Reidel's wife's name wasn't something like Betty (rather than Ana) - would probably never have caught on ;)
Would be interesting to know the date that the word 'Vaseline' did first see the light of day, though suspect the source is now lost.
Christine (Lustrousstone) is our guru when it comes to u. glass :) - and Christine's linked collection is a very useful source material - I started to plough through looking specifically for 'vaseline', then realized there were 113 pages, so stopped. There must be as many named varieties for colours/appearances of glass containing u. as there are days in the year - T/Webb's contribution alone is substantial.
I thought that Barry Skelcher's book 'The Big Book of Vaseline Glass' would be the answer if you wanted a definitive meaning as to the interpretation of vaseline, but how wrong can you be - neither in the preface, the intro., or the text (despite using the word once very vaguely), does it appear. Almost as though he was avoiding it deliberately - so why the title then. Well, it's obvious really - the publisher, Schiffer, is States based and, unlike the U.K., since the word carries such vast cache for collectors there, it was a must have word, together with values - which you sense Skelcher was really unhappy with providing. The U.S. Dollar to Sterilng R/E was no doubt very different in 2002.
I don't think the word is any more or less confusing than the other five dozen adjectives used for glass containing u., I do seem to recall that the stuff in the pot did have the appearance of opalescence. When I see or hear the word I'm reminded of the opalescent version of the Registered M.W. pike - looks just like the stuff in the pot, but I've not heard the pike described as vaseline.
There are some very well known trade marked designs/colours of glass from both sides of the pond, such as Burmese or Pearline, and we know immediately what is meant, but vaseline is open to interpretation by all of us, unfortunately, so perhaps best we say uranium glass and provide a picture, and Christine's suggestion of - "If you refer to it as uranium glass, you are not going to be wrong." - is more than useful.
By all means use the word, but we should remember as with all communications to qualify what we're saying - to quote some words from Cathy B. from back in 2005 (apologies Cathy) "Crystal in Australia is usually high quality glass with lead content. And people refer to watery milk glass as vaseline here as well. It's wrong, but the convention is so strong it's hard to know what to do about it".
So - anyone got a piece of vaseline milk glass to show ;) ;D
For a less than useful description of the word, and I'm surprised coming from someone like Raymond Notley, how about this from his 'Popular Glass of the 19th & 20th Centuries' .............. "vaseline glass - an anachronistic name for acidically coloured green or yellow glass". :(