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Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 10:00:30 AM

Title: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 10:00:30 AM
Hi guys
Can someone help with a question i have about a caithness paperweight
Called "bright new day" i believe its a limited edition of 50
I recieved it this morning and on the underneath it just has inscribed
"Bright new day " no edition number no caithness scotland  it doed
Have the whiteriars cane in the front side with the image
Could it be fake?
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Lustrousstone on October 05, 2012, 10:33:59 AM
I think we will need a picture
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chriscooper on October 05, 2012, 11:39:35 AM
One here on Worthpoint Christine a Caithness/Whitefriars one boxed with the limited edition 49/50
Pretty sure these would  be signed Caithness?Whitefriars  on the base as they were Whitefriars ones after Caithness took the name hence the monk cane, also should have the limited edition number on and the pattern name, how did the seller describe it, presuming you bought it on eBay Joe

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/caithness-whitefriars-glass-238843121

Chris
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Lustrousstone on October 05, 2012, 11:48:12 AM
I saw that, but we still need a picture of Joe's to see if there are any differences, i.e., is it facetted?

And they are marked Caithness: quote from the example you found
Quote
The star cut base is engraved : "Whitefriars Bright New Day Caithness Scotland 49-50"
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 12:09:02 PM
Hi
I bought in an auction in essex described as caithness bright new day  paperweight boxed
Came in a standard caithness white box, id love to post a pic but im so inept at
Uploading ive been trying for ages and nothing goes on but be happy to send pics to anyone intrested in looking
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 12:14:31 PM
Hi guys
 The weight is faceted and the sunburst bottom (star shaped) ive seen pics of the weight on line its just the underneath edition nos missing, will do my best to get some pics up at work at the monent but i thank you all for comments and help
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Lustrousstone on October 05, 2012, 12:17:16 PM
You need to resize your high-res picture so that the longest dimension is 700 pixels. that usually give a file that will upload using the attach facility below the reply box. If you can't work it out, email me the picture and I will upload it lustrousstone at homail dot com
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 01:46:36 PM
Hi guys
Ive read on a info page that when caithness closed the recievers sold the museum pieces and they
Didnt have anything on the bottom apart from the pieces title
Cant verify this could it be possible?
Or am i just cluthching at straws
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: pooleandpaperweights on October 05, 2012, 04:03:55 PM
Highly unlikely to be a fake.  Could well be a museum piece.  Wheren't there a few caithness weights in that sale?  Was it Staceys?  I might be wrong, but think I saw some pics of it.....

Ian
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 05, 2012, 04:23:09 PM
 ;)
Something is only a fake if is being passed off as something it is not.
Theoretically, sold as a Caithness Ltd. edn. weight, with a wfs cane in it, it could be considered a fake in this instance.
But given Caithness made weights for wfs, and the large collector base there is for a very restricted number of very high quality weights ever made.... not one I reckon you have very much to be complaining about.  ;D
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: pooleandpaperweights on October 05, 2012, 04:46:29 PM
Caithness brought the whitefriars name and made the first weights in 1981 (might be 82?).  They named their expensive weights Whitefriars from then, so I don't see how this could possibly be deemed a fake.  It is what it is.  A Caithness Whitefriars weight, which had monk canes.....
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 05, 2012, 05:11:23 PM
Hi guys
Thankyou so much for the info!!!  The glass community ate a fantastic bunch of collectors  only been collecting for 5 months and 95%of the people are great ive got the paperweight  bug badley
The reason ive asked if it was a fake was for if i decide to sell i like to give as much info as possible  and ive got very little knowledge of my own!!! I try and do my research andcthat lead me to you guys  who have been excellant and once i learn how to get pics up ive one or two more mysterious weights
ID JUST LIKE TO THANK ALL WHO HELPED ME TODAY
IM DO GRATEFUL  YOUR ALL STARS many many thanks
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 05, 2012, 05:22:24 PM
 :-[
Sorry - I had believed wfs got Caithness to make their weights for them.

I was merely being a bit tongue-in-cheek and pedantic.  ;D
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Lustrousstone on October 05, 2012, 06:04:24 PM
Here are pix sent by Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 05, 2012, 06:10:21 PM
Could that be a Paul Ysart?  :o
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chriscooper on October 05, 2012, 06:28:05 PM
 ;D

Chris
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Lustrousstone on October 05, 2012, 07:29:02 PM
Not with a monk cane in Caithness neodymium. It's probably archive stock
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 05, 2012, 07:35:16 PM
Ah well, that's me and bunches of flowers then.  ;D  They all look the same.
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 09, 2012, 10:20:41 AM
I was in the Caithness Factory shop just yesterday - I managed to sneak in for 2 minutes before they shut, but did have the opportunity to speak to a knowledgeable member of staff.
I even saw a few newly made Limited Edition "Whitefriars" Caithness weights. There are images on their site (link below).

They still have the original monk canes and are CURRENTLY making weights including a sliver of the cane.
I was given the catalogue containing the images of the 2012 weights, I have perused the website but cannot find any of the designs which may have been produced prior to 2012, but I an now thinking that your weight is one of the new ones. I did ask the lady about neodynum weights with a wfs cane, but she didn't seem to know what neodynum glass was... we really only had 2-3 minutes.
Linda Campbell is the amazing lampworker for several (if not all of them), she trained with the superlative Allan Scott - which would account for my muddling the quality of the lampwork with that of Paul Ysart.
I wouldn't confuse Allan Scott with Paul Ysart though. Allan wins, no contest.  (IMNSHO)
Anyway, here's a link to the Caithness website - I would recommend contacting them to ask about your weight.

Perhaps not a "museum piece" just yet.  ;D

http://www.caithnessglass.co.uk/


btw - is this your sale?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-caithness-whitefriars-neodynum-glass-paperweight-a-one-off-bright-new-day-/200829497776?pt=UK_Art_Glass&hash=item2ec25ef1b0


Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 12, 2012, 11:09:53 AM
Hi guys
Just wanted to add that ive had an email from caithness
And they have told me the maker was rosette fleming made in
97 at a cost of 135 pounds
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 12, 2012, 11:15:45 AM
Yay! Sorted. ;D
Good luck with your sale.
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: pooleandpaperweights on October 12, 2012, 11:23:03 AM
but that's just what is in the Charlton Catalogue.  Did they say anything about it not being signed, numbered, etc?

Ian
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chriscooper on October 12, 2012, 11:35:17 AM
Could quite easily be a trial piece for the range that would have been kept for display. I know this happened at Selkirk and these went onto the market when the receivers moved in they were signed but without the Ltd Edition numbers on the base.

Chris
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: joewol on October 12, 2012, 12:08:40 PM
Hi guys
I asked them the question
Could it be fake or a museum piece and the answer i got was just what ive posted they never confirmed or denied
i dont think its a test/study  piece as ive got one at home from the early days of caithness that after  mods turned into "alien" not sure of the year but that  info came from peter holmes himself via wuff
Regards
Joe
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 12, 2012, 04:08:00 PM
I've found a wee bit about Rosette Fleming here on Scotland's Glass.
http://www.scotlandsglass.co.uk/cms/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=181&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=6
and some weights here:
http://www.scotlandsglass.co.uk/cms/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=142&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=6
joewol, do you still have the original pics of your weight?
Would you be kind enough to let Scotland's Glass use them?  :)
I think Wuff is dealing with this onerous task at the moment.
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: Wuff on October 12, 2012, 09:56:27 PM
Thank you for reminding the readers of this forum of Scotland's Glass, Sue !

Joe and I have been corresponding regularly for some time now, and he's sent me loads of images - and offering more ;D.
Title: Re: possible caithness fake?
Post by: chopin-liszt on October 13, 2012, 08:49:27 AM
 :)
I may have "captured" Fire Dance last week, the sun came out and hit it perfectly; purely by chance. I did my best to sort out the background around it, and got a couple of shots before the batteries ran out. I do have a decent "Cartouche" shot.