Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Paperweights => Topic started by: dreama on January 16, 2014, 12:56:50 AM
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I have a degenhart pw I bought about 6 months ago. Today I noticed it looked strange it appeared to be peeling like very thin paint. I attempted to wipe it with my fingers and it cut me. It is a very thin layer almost like a thin layer of glass. . Does anyone know if spray on diy glass is ever used to make pw look better before selling them?
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Spray on may help it look better but I don't know if it is used. It is not permanent, I think your best bet is to clean it well and sell as is so there is no question of trying to deceive.
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I tried to clean it, but its impossbile without cutting my hands, once i found it looked strange, i tired. I have never seen anything like it. My dad and both grandfathers were glass workers, and in 50 years I never saw any glass do this. It looks like old pealing paint, but its clear glass. Even the seconds dad used to bring home, never did this. I have seen exploding glass, when they were seconds. But this, is not like that at all, I am a collector, and now I am worried about buying any pw's. how do I know the seller did not spray them with glass paint? Honestly I cant sell it like that, who would want a pw you cant touch without getting cut. This is all over it, even the polished bottom is sharp and peeling. I fear a may have to throw it away?
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Photographs would be very interesting, if you would be kind enough to post some. :)
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Could it be a thick acrylic/resin spray perhaps, but I can't imagine why it would be used.
Nick
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To disguise scratches?
In a similar way to those who disguise water marks with silicon oil (or even baby oil >:( ) inside decanters and bottles.
I'm sorry to hear of the OP being injured on the bits coming off!
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Degenhart weights have been known to do this. There was a discussion on this board about this at one time I believe. I don't know if a weight like this could be resurfaced or if it does indeed just need disposed.
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I have taken some pics, so you can see what I mean. The little cracks all over it, are a very thin layer, really thin. Like tiny paint chips. I did not know degenhart did this, I have several mosser and they are fine. All my other degenhart pws are fine so far.
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I forgot to say, this weight was almost perfect a few weeks ago.
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That looks exactly like what is called crizzling. It does happen to old glass.
I've seen it in old perfume bottles, but the cracking goes right through the whole body of the vessel.
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I have a lot of PW's that are much older than this one. What would cause this?
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A shock of some sort?
Heat or cold, a sudden change might do it - but it would depend on what stresses are in the weight after annealling.
If there had been a temperature fluctuation during annealing, a weight might look perfect, but still have a load of strange stresses inside.
In older times, control of annealling oven temperatures was not as good as it is today.
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Yes I would say it was a shock, because my family has had glass for as long as I can remember, and I am over 50. I even have some my grandfather made at Cambridge around 1910, and never saw it happen. We did not have alot of dengenhart, mostly, cambridge, heisey, mosser, imperial and variety glass. I played with it as kid, ( makes great doll furniture) lol! I have other pieces, pw's from degenhart I hope they dont do this? I checked them all, and so far so good, is this something that happens due to something in the production? Or something in my house?
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Did you do something to clean this after you bought it. It looks like the entire surface is fractured. Could someone have put it in a dishwasher? Or was it packed in luggage on a trip?
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Nope, none of the above. It has not been in the dishwasher, and sits on shelf with other PWs. it has not moved, in 6 months. I bought it 6 months ago, it came through the mail, I bought it online. The PW was nice, no cracks and very few if any scratches. But now, It is completly covered, in this peeling even the polished bottom looks like the rest. It has had the dust wiped off, with a damp cotton cloth, no soap a few times when dusting. I dont use any soaps, or adbrasives on any of my glass. It is only the outer layer that is cracked, and peeling. Thats why I thought it may have been sprayed to cover any marks. But now after seeing pics of crizzling, i do think that is what it is. And if I am reading right, it is a degradation process. It is caused by an inherent fault in the chemical composition of the original glass formula. Please let me know if this is correct ?
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Here is a thread with links to other threads discussing this sort of thing.
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,13283.msg86784.html#top
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That link is very interesting, oak for me it not the answer. Mainly because my PWs are on a shelf, not encased in glass. The shelf is not oak, but a cheap pressed board. I do have a glass case, but I dont keep the PWs in it, its full of old cambridge and hesiey, and a few fenton pieces. I live in a very low humidity place, it is very dry here. I checked all the weights i have and none feel oily, and none are cloudy. I also did not notice any smell at all. That includes the crackled one. Which does not really match what I have read, about weeping glass. But it does look like crizzling. And whatever is peeling is glass, and sharp thats for sure. If not crizzle then what? I know nothing of that spray on glass, but could that maybe be whats happened and not crizzling? I have several other degenhart weights, grave markers and even a gear shift knob and they are all still fine.
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I read that high alkali glass causes crizzling, anyone know if thats correct?
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Hi
This link in the before mentioned thread seems quite a likely candidate http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/News/2005/September/26090501.asp (http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/News/2005/September/26090501.asp)
As mentioned in that thread pressed board as you mention your shelf is made of (presumably MDH or chipboard/particle board) are made with Formaldehyde resins which as the link states could cause the degradation. Also as it mentions the sticky surface residue could be Sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) which is highly toxic, best not to taste it!
Also if I read it correctly you seem to say you use a product called no soap what is this made of?
It has had the dust wiped off, with a damp cotton cloth, no soap a few times when dusting.
Nick
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No, I meant I used No soap, not a product, just plain water and a soft cloth. The shelfs are pressed board, but they are painted. I have several PWs on these shelves, more degenharts, mosser, and gentile. None did what this one did yet. None ever felt oily, or wet. I found no crystals on any of them before this, and none became foggy or cloudy. This one was never cloudy, oily, or wet. It is also is not the oldest one I have on the shelves. This peeling, happened within a matter of days, with no other signs of problems. I found there are conflicting reports on why crizzling happens, here is one link
http://www.cmog.org/glass-dictionary/crizzling (http://www.cmog.org/glass-dictionary/crizzling)
http://arthistory.about.com/od/glossary/g/c_crizzling.htm (http://arthistory.about.com/od/glossary/g/c_crizzling.htm)
Then there are the links above that you mentioned about oak, and cabinets.
The pics do look like what has happened to my PW but, there is no clouding. If you look closely at my pic, it is very clear. The glass is not at all cloudy, like the one in the link below.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass_disease (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass_disease)
There was something strange about the PW that did that, at least to me. It was a weight that said, elisabeth degenhart, first lady of glass. I have seen ones like that that are very similiar, but all have a 'D" on the name plate, this one did not. So, it was my thought, it may have been a second, or mistake, or made by Boyd who bought degenhart, after elisabeth died any Body took over. I am not sure if that is important, or not, but its just a thought.
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I meant Boyd took over after Elisabeths death