Glass Message Board
Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass => Unresolved Glass Queries => Topic started by: vidrioguapo on September 08, 2005, 05:19:00 PM
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So pathetic are my IT skills, having to do one at a time:
http://tinypic.com/dhalgl
Pair of "beaked". 9.5" high and a good 1cm thick at top with good ground and bevelled edges. One of the Scandinavian makers, perhaps?
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could be Gralglashütte from Germany.... but no guarantee
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Me again - just wondering if anyone had info on this bottle vase. It's a sort of dark olive smoked glass, is very heavy and has signs of age wear to the base - 9.5in/24cm tall. What's most interesting is the very sharp cut and shape to the rim - sort of eye shaped and bevelled. Thanks for any help ...
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g60/pips-trip/greenbottle0001.jpg
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PLEASE HELP SAVE BROADFIELD HOUSE GLASS MUSEUM
YOUR VOICE COUNTS
Yes, Czech - designed by Josef Hospodka. I think there was mention on W/F's.com when Richard bought one........
Nigel
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Can you please tell me another source than eBay descriptions that this piece can be attributed to Hospodka?
I have not find it anywhere in my resources for the meanwhile.
Thank you
Jindrich
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Glad to see the brain cells are still active Max. You are right and at the time it was thought to be Graal.
Jindrich, I have seen the Hospodka attribution just recently, but I now cannot find it. I was given the Hospodka ID this morning by someone prominent in the glass world, so have assumed it was correct as it matched the previous information I saw ( and now can't find!)
What are your views on it? Emmi
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here it is again
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e57/emmismith/Czech/No53Graal.jpg)
Emmi
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Can you please tell me another source than eBay descriptions that this piece can be attributed to Hospodka?
I have not find it anywhere in my resources for the meanwhile.
Thank you
Jindrich
I have been informed by Graham Cooley that this is an early Hospodka, c. 1959 perhaps, as a similar vase with the same rim treatment, appeared in the Czech Glass Review of 1961.
Emmi
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Hi,
My attribution is based on two that were shown in the 'Hi Sklo Lo Sklo'exhibition of Graham Cooley's collection of Czech glass at KIng's Lynn last year. There were two on the top of the fish tank - in case anyone out there needs a mind jog (of course if you went to see it ;) :) ).
Nigel
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No, I haven't seen the Hi Sklo exhibition, fortunately here in Czech republic we have other museums where Czechoslovakian pieces are displayed.
In Glasrevue from 1961 I found only one Hospodka vase - in no 1, UMPRUM musem exhibits other, see coloured picture.
Not single one is simmilar to this. So my doubts persists.
Jindrich
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PLEASE HELP SAVE BROADFIELD HOUSE GLASS MUSEUM
YOUR VOICE COUNTS
Jindrich,
Given your access to copies of the Czech Glass Review and your obvious experience of Czech glass I am now concerned about the attribution, especially as Graham Cooley has kindly confirmed to Emmi his attribution is based upon a similar vase seen in the Czech Glass Review and not an identical one.
Nigel
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Hi,
Like Jindrich, I would not have attributed this to Hospodka. The rim design is however, one that is found in the design output of Vaclav Hanus, for Jablonecke Sklo. That is one of the two Czech producers which would spring immediately to mind for this item, the other being ZBS.
(CGR is, as Jindrich and I know only too well, not the infallible contemporary resource one might assume).
Regards,
Marcus
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Hi Emmi
Whoops, 2yrs out, that's what you get doing things from memory; Its CGR 1963 p161 (I think; can't quiet see the last digit on my photocopy); designed in 1962 by Josef Hospodka; different shape, as I mentioned, but the same top.
Graham
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Hospodka pieces from Glasrevue 1963 pages 161 and 162 attached.
Next try Graham? :D
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some problems with attachements, so once more again :--)
Jindrich
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Hi Emmi
Whoops, 2yrs out, that's what you get doing things from memory; Its CGR 1963 p161 (I think; can't quiet see the last digit on my photocopy); designed in 1962 by Josef Hospodka; different shape, as I mentioned, but the same top.
Graham
Hi Graham, the top on these bottles is very distinctive - can you provide us with the image of the item you refer to as having 'the same top'?
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Reference as above
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Good try Graham!
I have found that in German version of Glasrevue your page is 165. :hiclp:
Anyway, based od similar shape of rim I would not attribute it generaly to Hospodka, but the suspicion is relevant.
Seems to me better would be alway reffer to year/month of CGR rather then year page - page numbering is different in language versions.
Jindrich
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Hi,
From Graham's picture I would certainly agree that the tops of the vases are identical. It would seem logical to me, and typical of the czech practice to simply the designs for "mass production", that they were Hospodka. I've seen many of the vases like Emmi's at fairs etc and they all seem to come in the typical czech colours aswell - such as the citrine and lilac colours that the common Klinger pieces are found in.
Cheers,
Richard
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Just a notice, Klinger had designed for Zeleznobrodské sklo n.p. (ZBS) and Hospodka for Chribska and Prachen, both factories subsidiary of Borské sklo n.p. Hospodka's bottles were never fabricated in "mass production" and in fact you can find them rather in museums than at markets.
Suprising me also, that this piece I have not seen anywhere here, in Czech republic but I have seen it 4 times at UK eBay.
Jindrich
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From Graham's picture I would certainly agree that the tops of the vases are identical. It would seem logical to me, and typical of the czech practice to simply the designs for "mass production", that they were Hospodka. I've seen many of the vases like Emmi's at fairs etc and they all seem to come in the typical czech colours aswell - such as the citrine and lilac colours that the common Klinger pieces are found in.
Hi Richard, whilst I agree there's a good likeness in the rims they're certainly not 'identical'. If you look at Emmi's and my vases again you'll see that the eye shaped rim is totally horizontal, the one in the catalogue that Graham has shown is slanted upwards. So when you take into consideration that the body shapes are also very different all we've got between the original vases and the catalogue photo really is a similarity in the rim finish and not a lot else.
*Edit* with regard to the colour and frequency of these vases - being a dealer I'm constantly on the lookout for glass at auctions, bootsales, charity shops etc and I've only seen 3 of these vases in the flesh in the 5/6 years I've been doing this and they've all been the same dark bluey green colour. I personally don't think it's sensible we should use items members have *seen* but not shown, as confirmation that they were produced in other colours and therefore must be Hospodka or whoever - it's all way too tenuous IMO - they could be completely different vases.
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I agree - I have seen similar things made in Germany (was it Friedrich? Was it Hirschberg? Was it Wiesenthalhütte?) so unless there is a 100% match better err on the safe side.
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Hi Pip,
I just can't see a difference in the rims:
As for my comments on the colours. I was simply trying to add supporting evidence that the vases I have seen (probably 4 in the last year) have been in colours that I typically associate to known czech designs.
Thanks,
Richard
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I *can* see a difference - the rim in the catalogued vase appears to be pulled higher at one end.
With regard to the other colours, if you can post some photos up of them here that would be far preferable (and much more helpful) from a research point of view than simply anecdotal evidence. Knowing how easily mistakes can be made (and I assure you I've made some howlers in my time) I now require much more than fairly loose comparisons and anecdotes before I'll positively attribute something - we all know how eager eBayers are to pounce on information and relay it as fact and thus a new myth is born!
Plus, it has to be said that both Marcus and Jindrich have their doubts about the Hospodka attribution and their extensive knowledge of Czech glass shouldn't be dismissed lightly.