Glass Message Board

Glass Identification - Post here for all ID requests => Glass Trinket Sets => Topic started by: Simba on July 07, 2012, 04:42:35 PM

Title: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Simba on July 07, 2012, 04:42:35 PM

I just bought these pale blue candlesticks, they are exactly the same basic shape as Walther Poseidon pattern but pattern is different.
Any idea's ? ???

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Anne on July 09, 2012, 02:06:23 AM

Walther Mary pattern I think...

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Simba on July 09, 2012, 01:06:39 PM

Thankyou !!  ;D

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Anne on October 15, 2014, 07:00:00 PM

Angela, are the bases on your blue candlesticks, above, a regular hexagon shape or are they elongated? 

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Simba on October 15, 2014, 09:01:40 PM

Hi Anne they are elongated...is this significant? :)

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Anne on October 16, 2014, 01:05:51 AM

Thanks Angela. I'm not sure if it is or not yet - I'm exploring!  ;D

Jayne mentioned the difference in the Mary candlesticks in her post here: http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,38101.msg240217.html#msg240217 (http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,38101.msg240217.html#msg240217) but as I now have examples of both I was just following it up a bit more.

It's not possible to tell from the 1936 or 1937 catalogues what the base shape is, but the big ones all seem to be regular hexagons and the smaller ones all seem to be elongated hexagons... not sure where this is taking me...  yet... ;)

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: agincourt17 on October 16, 2014, 09:32:42 AM

For some reason, my understanding is that there were two versions of the Walther Mary set.

The most common version has a rectangular tray with scalloped edges and a star centre, and the candlesticks were tall and had a regular hexagonal base (just like Angela’s). The finials on the pot lids are vertically-grooved cylinders with grooved pointed tips.  I have reference photos for three sets with just such a combination of features to the pieces.

I also have photos for a couple of sets (both in green uranium glass) with short candlesticks (having elongated hexagonal bases, a tray with two short, scalloped sides, two long ‘curved’ sides, and a criss cross base pattern (with scalloping beneath each ‘square’), and pot lid finial a bit like a fishtail with 3 scoops to the top edge. This Mary lidded pot is shown in the 1937 musterbuch at
http://www.glas-musterbuch.de/Walther-1937.76+B6YmFja1BJRD03NiZwcm9kdWN0SUQ9MzIzOSZkZXRhaWw9.0.html
This Walther Mary version seems to be much less common.

I suspect that the green uranium glass version I show (the latter one) is pre-WW2, whereas I suppose that the former version is possibly a post-WW2 version.

Fred.

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: agincourt17 on October 16, 2014, 10:25:00 AM

Just by way of reference, I can see why the latter version of the Mary set might be confused with the Walther Poseidon set in that the overall shape of the tray, candlesticks and pot lid finials are quite similar (though they obviously differ in the detail of decorative surface pattern, and the top edges of the Poseidon pot lid finials are flat).

The Walther Waltraut tray and Walther Munster tray also has that ‘2 straight short sides and 2 curved long sides’ overall shape, and the Walther Munster pot lid finial a fishtail or dovetail shape (but with a flat top edge).

Fred.

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: Anne on October 16, 2014, 07:30:25 PM

Thanks Fred, that's very helpful. I was idly wondering if the two versions might have been pre and post war, but then both sticks appear in the 1930's... or if one was an adult version and one a teen version (like Sowerby's Maid set, aimed at younger females)?  The difference in the sticks and the pots is remarkable, so it really is a mystery as to why they all have the same name!

Title: Re: pale blue Walther candlesticks ?
Post by: agincourt17 on October 17, 2014, 08:41:43 PM

Something familiar about these sets has been nagging away at the back of my mind, so I have gone back through my photos of some of the ‘unknown’ sets I have submitted for ID at various times and have come across a previous GMB topic thread (in fact, a thread merged from two others)
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,50039.msg282700.html#msg282700
which showed:

Tray with 2 curved long sides and 2 straight short sides (with handles); base of the tray gently 'quilted' or chequerboarded diagonally on the underside.

Candlesticks with elongated hexagonal bases, and stems of hexagonal cross section; stems vertically ridged.

Ringholder with base echoing shape of tray.

3 circular lidded pots (1 large & 2 small), the most distinctive feature being the flattened lid finials which have a flattened, stepped ‘podium’ top profile with the centre section vertically ribbed (but with the base and lid very similar to those of the Walther Mary variant set) .

The sets shown in this combined thread have so many features in common with the Walther Mary and Walther Poseidon sets that they just HAVE to have been made by Walther – don’t they?

I will post or re-post some photos to make it easier for direct comparisons here.
(Permission for the re-use of these images on the GMB granted by nigel79w, Jean Bonney and  carmichael_uk respectively)

Fred.