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Glass Discussion & Research. No ID requests here please. => Bohemia, Czechoslovakia, Czech Republic, Austria => Topic started by: David E on July 25, 2005, 11:57:34 PM

Title: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on July 25, 2005, 11:57:34 PM
Hi,

Following are photos of two vases that I believe are Czech – both in a typical chunky glass in a beautiful emerald-green and have ribbed sides with a slight waist.

:: Please click thumbnails to enlarge ::

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/t-czech-green02.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/czech-green02.jpg) : (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/t-czech-green03.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/czech-green03.jpg) : (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/t-czech-green04.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/czech-green04.jpg)

The taller one is 8" (20cm) tall, the smaller one is 6" (15cm) and both have indented bases with a ground base ring.

Any ideas on the maker?

Also, are there any other sizes in this range?
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: paradisetrader on July 26, 2005, 12:38:42 AM
Rudolfova Hut part of Sklo Union by Rudolf Schrötter or Frantisek Vizner around 1940.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on July 26, 2005, 07:03:14 AM
Good id, Peter, Schrotter, and as you say around 1940, with production, initally by Inwald, at Rudolfova, until the 1960's at least.
Sorry David, I can't confirm any other sizes.
Regards,
Marcus
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 24, 2005, 01:04:04 PM
Recently I managed to find another of these waisted vases except in a turquoise colour:

::  click thumbnail to enlarge ::

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/t-czech-green05.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/czech-green05.jpg)

Note the slight difference in height.

I see from the eponymouse bullet vases...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/bullet-vases01.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/bullet-vases01.jpg)
... these were also designed by Rudolf Schrötter for Rudolfova Huť, so is it reasonable to assume there could be three other colours: amber, pink and blue? If so, that means five colours and two sizes! :roll:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Ivo on August 24, 2005, 02:07:21 PM
While we're @ it - any thoughts on this one?

(http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10056/thumb_zemek5659.jpg) (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-1740)

it has escaped all attempts identification so far, I hope the advances of DNA matching can help it find its family.....  8)
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on August 24, 2005, 02:12:43 PM
Quote from: "DenCill"
Recently I managed to find another of these waisted vases except in a turquoise colour:

 :shock: click thumbnail to enlarge :shock:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/t-czech-green05.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/czech-green05.jpg)

Note the slight difference in height.

I see from the eponymouse bullet vases...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/bullet-vases01.jpg
... these were also designed by Rudolf Schrötter for Rudolfova Huť, so is it reasonable to assume there could be three other colours: amber, pink and blue? If so, that means five colours and two sizes! :roll:



David - here's my amber version referred to in the previous thread.  Stands 5.75" high.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/bohemian002.jpg

Regards - Anne E.B.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 24, 2005, 02:34:48 PM
Quote from: "Anne E.B."
David - here's my amber version referred to in the previous thread. Stands 5.75" high.


Thanks for that Anne: I forgot to say these were both the 5¾" versions.

Can't help with yours Ivo, but I'm sure I've seen one like this offered on eBay. I also have two others that I keep meaning to ask about!

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/blue-czech1-t.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/blue-czech1.jpg) : (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/ashtray-czech03-t.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/ashtray-czech03.jpg)

The first looks like a hand grenade, the second is an ashtray but with a totally flat ground & polished base. Any ideas on these?
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Max on August 24, 2005, 03:29:43 PM
I uploaded the same blue vase a few weeks ago David (what do you mean, you missed it??!!)  :wink:

Here's what Marcus said about it:

Quote
Max,
your blue vase, what size?
This is one of Frantisek Vizner's earliest designs for Sklo Union. Hermanova Hut, Plzen. around 1962.
Size should be around 20cm high.

A nice purchase.


This is mine: http://tinypic.com/6pakuh.jpg
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anonymous on August 24, 2005, 04:53:33 PM
Quote from: "Max"
I uploaded the same blue vase a few weeks ago David (what do you mean, you missed it??!!)  :wink: ...

Hermanova Hut, Plzen. around 1962.
Size should be around 20cm high.


 :oops:  Oops, yes I did miss it. I think around that time I was rather busy and wasn't visiting the board much. I'm sure you know what it's like when you come back... masses of new postings to wade through.

However, my vase is only 5¾" (14.5cm) tall so, once again, we are finding variations on a theme. Nice to have this information at last - I've had this vase for about 2 years :wink:

BTW, where is Marcus? Holiday :?: :?:  
He didn't ask permission to leave! :lol:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 24, 2005, 08:30:08 PM
Ivo wrote:
Quote
it has escaped all attempts identification so far, I hope the advances of DNA matching can help it find its family.....


I have a feeling this is not a mystery, but among the last pieces designed by Frantisek Zemek, in the three years just before he died. This is most likely from Rudolfova Hut, between 1956 and 1959, as his designs for Hermanova H'ut, Plzen, were much more fluid.

Sorry Ivo, cannot be more definite than that, given the very small amount of contemporary published documentation. Is this large? as recently someone showed me an ash-tray in the same pattern.

Regards,

Marcus
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 25, 2005, 10:20:51 PM
Well, I've finally come across a photo for the "violett" colour!

 :shock: click thumbnail to enlarge :shock:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/violet-czech1-t.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/violet-czech1.jpg) : (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/yellow-czech1-t.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/dencill/green-czech/yellow-czech1.jpg)

Think this will be of interest to Anne and Max :?:  :)

Photo courtesy of Wayne at 20th Century Glass.

Additionally, I've included Anne's photo to show as a comparison - interesting that the top looks slightly more flared than the others. Please let me know if this is alright Anne, otherwise I'll remove the photo.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Ivo on August 26, 2005, 06:28:56 AM
Quote from: "Le Casson"

I have a feeling this is not a mystery, but among the last pieces designed by Frantisek Zemek, in the three years just before he died. This is most likely from Rudolfova Hut, between 1956 and 1959, as his designs for Hermanova H'ut, Plzen, were much more fluid.
Sorry Ivo, cannot be more definite than that, given the very small amount of contemporary published documentation. Is this large? as recently someone showed me an ash-tray in the same pattern.
Marcus


Sorry it is in storage in the "heavy items" box. I think it is about 20 cm and weighs a ton.  I can believe there would be an ashtray as well - it is that sort of design.... :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on August 26, 2005, 09:13:22 AM
Quote from: "DenCill"
...

Additionally, I've included Anne's photo to show as a comparison - interesting that the top looks slightly more flared than the others. Please let me know if this is alright Anne, otherwise I'll remove the photo.


I've taken another view - straight on this time.  See what you think David.  Apologies for the grey background.  I'm still trying to overcome that, so the colour of the glass contrasts better to show its true colour.  If you want to crop/whiten the background - feel free to do so.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/bohemianamber002.jpg

Regards - Anne E.B. :lol:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 26, 2005, 09:28:49 AM
Morning Anne,

Ah, just an optical illusion I think (or in my case, an optical delusion :lol: ).

Re. the photos, I simply use a fluorescent strip light with a daylight bulb (about 8") and angle it towards the rear to give plenty of backlight; sometimes I angle the light to reflect off the paper, but the light is virtually always behind the glass. The camera then automatically defaults to daylight mode (no flash) so there's no distracting reflections.

I place the glass on white paper that folds slowly upwards and this helps to eliminate any sharp edge 'horizon' lines.

The only problem is that the photos do need tweaking afterwards as they are a little dull, so normally a 10-20% increase on brightness and 5-10% on contrast 'freshens' them up. You can use a free program like IrfanView – http://www.irfanview.com – to correct any photo.

Hope this helps anyone who needs a simple and cheap-ish solution [I still intend to build a lightbox one day though! :D ]
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on August 27, 2005, 01:23:11 AM
I like both the vases by Rudolf Schrötter for Rudolfova Huť - I have a few of these in blue, amber, green - but I would like to stick up for the bullet vase - they are just as nice as these and work well as companion pieces in a collection

http://tinypic.com/b7bfvm.jpg
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on August 27, 2005, 11:33:09 AM
I quite agree David555 - check out my growing collection of 'bullet' vases http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/RudolfShrotterBulletVasesforRudolfo.jpg I just love this type of glass.  :lol:

Regards - Anne E.B. :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on August 28, 2005, 01:29:53 AM
I have recently found these two vases in my collection were made by Rudolfova Huť and probably designed by Rudolf Schrötter (?) - the bases are exactly the same (that deep base rim) and the mould lines are just so that factory (good sources on different forums have advised me ref) - the colour ways are also well compaired - these are heavier and at 7.5" and 9" imposing - It would be good to start a thread on the bits made by Rudolfova Huť  - at the moment bits are cheap but values are set to increase as more info leaks out

http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-1981
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 28, 2005, 04:59:29 AM
David,

Quote
(good sources on different forums have advised me ref)


The first vase may or may not be Rudolfova, and possibly Schrotter.

The second vase, if my memory serves me well, appeared on this board in blue some time ago, and was identified then as a product of the scandinavian glassworks Ruda.

You should also be wary of Schrotter attributions. He was not the only designer for Rudolfova, and also worked in the UK in the 1930s. Other designers' work from Rudolfova already fetches extremely good money.

Simply having a deep base-well does not immediately make a piece Rudolfova, or for that matter any of the major Czechoslovakian pressed  glass works. I have seen this same feature on Polish and Russian glass of the same period.

Also. be careful of this glass as a long-term investment. more than two thirds of ALL Czechoslovakian pressed glass during the period 1948-1990 went to Comecon countries and there is a massive amount of it about. Heppners(London) Ltd, the UKs largest importer of pressed glass from Sklo Union, in the 1960s were importing @ £2 million pounds worth of pressed glass per year at that time.

Respectfully,

Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on August 28, 2005, 01:41:40 PM
True - I take that point  - it's just my feeling that these are Czech and are so finished and moulded in the same way as the waisted and bullet vases - I have to say the bases of both the vases are identical and I can't see the grey one being Ruda - I have a fair amount of their stuff - they came together and I know they are the same company in my bones

Listen all I am saying is at £3.00 each in a proper retro/antique store - they have to be of some investment value even if not by Rudolfova (and remember some Sklo Union is getting OK money, taking into account the generic 'Made in Bohemia' can mean any number of good or bad union makers)

I will stick by Rudolfova for both bits, I do take your point maybe not by Schrotter - I couldn't be bothered to reel off any of the other designers names, I stand corrected on that  :D
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on August 28, 2005, 04:49:52 PM
Here is a pic of bases of both vases (the ones we are discussing) – tell me if they are not very similar – enough to come to a conclusion – then compare to the bullet and wasted vase bases and you will all se what I am saying here  :!:

Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Ivo on August 29, 2005, 06:46:46 AM
http://tinypic.com/bdsimd.jpg
http://tinypic.com/bdsizm.jpg

While on topic 'emerald green' - can anybody dowze this triangular one? Same bottom finish as all the other ones, but I think that only says something about the manufacturing process, not the manufacturer. Height 16 cms (that is 6.3.4" for the metrically challenged).

Is it Sklo or is it Lasi?  :roll:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 29, 2005, 07:32:28 AM
David,

With all due respect, I still do not think that the second of your vases is Czech, but then what I know about post-war, communist-era,  Czechoslovakian glass-making, can be written on the back of a postage stamp.

Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on August 29, 2005, 07:18:46 PM
Ivo ref your triangular vase - feels czech - it's moulded in that certain way and those simple angular shapes with the thick glass and deep base rim - I would say czech - but why Sklo Union and if you knew - what maker - I have a lot of union glass with simple label 'made in Bohemia' (not the Borske Sklo labels) on it but its like a generic Murano label - is there a thread on here for the miriad of makers and labels coming from Sklo Union?
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 29, 2005, 08:14:39 PM
I have the utmost respect for Ivo, the man who knows so much, but is unafraid to ask, likewise Nigel Benson, Bernard Cavalot, Kev Holt, Glen, Adam D, Frank Andrews...... all leading and acknowledged experts in their field and willing contributors to this board. I am quite happy to walk in their shadows.

There are no cliques here. What there is, is an unerring desire for accuracy.

respectfully,

Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 30, 2005, 05:54:37 AM
Czechoslovakian pressed glass post-war, a couple of recent observations.

When a design is known to have been made at a particular glassworks, it is not safe to assume all pieces in that pattern were made at that factory.

An example. A pattern by Milos Filip was put into production at Sklo Union's Rosice glass-works as vase #602. I have documentary evidence showing that the matching glass candle-stick (#2058/5) and ashtray (#2045) were produced at the Nemsova glassworks.

This may have been for one of two reasons. The first, simply that there was not sufficient spare capacity to make the complete range at one factory. The second, that the pattern was trialed at Skrdlovice, and then transferred, as a pressed glass design, and shared between the two factories, a situation not uncommon there.

The second observation is that often a contemporary source rarely gives the whole picture. Raban for example clearly states that a pressed glass container came from Rudolfova Hut in one colourway, a clear non-lead crystal base with green lid. Yet the same pattern, by Josef Soukup, number 13093, which was introduced in 1960, was offered in the reverse colourway in 1964.

The difficulties experienced due to centralised planning and control of the economy often meant shortages of materials, and thus simply because a source states "available in six colours", it is not necessarily the case that examples can be found in those colours.

Regards,

Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 30, 2005, 09:09:08 AM
That's a very good point: we tend to assume Western standards, but the Communist era did impact on supply & demand through the East European countries and certain materials used to colour glass wouldn't be exempt from this. No point scrabbling around trying to find all these examples then, when they might not exist!

Marcus, can you e-mail me?
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on August 31, 2005, 01:58:07 PM
As regards Ivos' vase, I have an image in a Czech catalogue, Frantisek Zemek, published by CMVU 1963, which appears to show a variant of this vase, from what appears to be an odd angle. Despite that, IMHO, it is the same vase.

Base-wells.

"Simply having a deep base-well does not immediately make a piece Rudolfova, or for that matter any of the major Czechoslovakian pressed glass works. I have seen this same feature on Polish and Russian glass of the same period. "

However. given the images of the two base-wells in particular, the green one appears to be typically Sklarny Inwald NP/Filled &Pressed Glass National Corporation/Sklo Union output. The second appears not to be as deep as usual. That coupled with the external decoration are the reasons for suggesting that this is Scandinavian.

Regards,

Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David E on August 31, 2005, 03:34:55 PM
Personally, I greatly value Le Casson's opinions, which have always been clear, concise, authoritative and unbiased. Where the information is not to hand, this has been clearly stated. I also know that Le Casson has a great deal of accurate historical information to hand and does not work from divining rods, joint aches or certain fluids passed from the body (as in; I have a feeling in my water...)

Additionally, I greatly respect the other authors, writers and collectors, et al, who frequent this board and give their time to give considered views. I also enjoy the cut & thrust of informed debate and as a relative newbie to glass collecting will freely admit to making mistakes here, that I will acknowledge with good grace.

So carry on giving me your excellent advice, Marcus, I certainly don't have a problem with that :wink:

Now, what were we talking about...? 8)
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: vidfletch on October 14, 2005, 01:13:19 AM
Ok, right, there's no Ruda vases that I know of there in all of that thread!

Bohemia Glass bullet vases. Nice and very common. I have had a few with the Bohemia Glass label on them. Quite often mistaken for Whitefriars vases! Don't know why!

Vidfletch :D
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on October 15, 2005, 01:32:35 AM
HI Marcus and everyone

I was out today and picked up these two vase - same as my green one

http://www.hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/pin%20blue2.jpg

http://www.hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/base%201.jpg base

Also in same box was this vase that seems to be by same manufacturer

http://www.hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/blue%20flower.jpg

http://www.hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/f%20base.jpg base

I hope this adds to the debate on the vases

Adam D555 :twisted:  :twisted:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne on October 15, 2005, 06:36:43 PM
Quote from: "DenCill"
Hi,

Following are photos of two vases that I believe are Czech – both in a typical chunky glass in a beautiful emerald-green and have ribbed sides with a slight waist.


Whilst out and about today I spotted three short candlesticks (perhaps about 2.5 inches tall) in clear glass with what appears to be the same pattern as these vases. One of the candlesticks had a label on it, saying Bohemian Krystal Czechoslovakia. I don't know if this helps at all. I didn't buy them but if they might be useful I'll see if they're still there when I go back later in the week.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: LynWebster on October 16, 2005, 10:44:02 PM
This is most of a growing collection of Czech I've picked up in the last few weeks. The 2 smallest (pair) ashtrays are pressed & less well-finished than the rest. I added an emerald bowl (match to top right) this morning.

(http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/5716/izzitt9az.th.jpg) (http://img384.imageshack.us/my.php?image=izzitt9az.jpg)

I love it, and soon the rest of the world will too......! I think my favourite's the Amethyst bullet - probably because it's the only one I've ever seen......
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on October 16, 2005, 11:15:15 PM
Schrotter 3, Matura 1, Zemek 1, Jurnikl 1, Jablonecke Sklo 2, bez autorem 2, but all in all, a nice set of glass.
Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on November 05, 2005, 02:58:31 PM
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/vase001.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/vase002.jpg

Thought this vase might be of interest.   I bought it this morning thinking I had spotted another Bohemian vase.  It looked very like my hobnail/pyramid vase and David555's which was discussed earlier in this thread.  However, I was very surprised to find it had Italy impressed on the base, which was revealed when cleaned.  There is also a small five pointed star with a circle in the centre.

I've taken a pic. to compare the two.  
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/vase003.jpg

The Italy vase is cylindrical.  It's hobnail effect is slightly different.  The base is very different with a noticeably deep 1.5cm recess.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y195/glassie/vase004.jpg

It looks Bohemian and I guess I have more questions than answers.  I'm not sure which vase is the older, but assuming that the Czech one is older, were their designs copied or did their designers perhaps take their skills and ideas elsewhere?

I'd welcome any thoughts please :P

Regards - Anne E.B. :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on November 06, 2005, 01:46:44 AM
Hi Anne

I love this vase, it shows that Italy did moulded glass in the 1960s / 70s very much in the style of Czech (Bohemian) – I have the same one as well which also says ‘Italy’ on the base in raised letters, it is a mystery how J Miller Guide 2004 pp283 has the vase down as ‘Royal Bohemia’ 1970. I presume that the Miller vase was not impressed with Italy on the base, and with it looking like other Royal Bohemia vases it was given the attribution, I have actually never seen this vase without ‘Italy’ on the base so perhaps I am wrong and it is an exact copy of a Royal Bohemia vase, can anyone shed any light on this?

I have very similar clear moulded glass vases with different designs marked ‘Fidenza Italy’ to the base in raised letters c1970 (very similar), the base well is also close. While very similar in type to the vases we have with just ‘Italy’ I cannot say if they are by ‘Fidenza’ as well, anyone know if there is a connection?

There is a very strong connection in the design of your (and my) Italian wavy design vase to the pineapple design and I really appreciate you bringing this into the debate. Marcus is working along the lines of the blue and green Pineapple vases being Czech and I tend to agree, the vase within this thread that he is looking at is the pewter grey vase with triangular moulding and a hexagonal base, I was questioning whether it might also be Czech, but have spoken to Marcus about certain differences and with his extensive knowledge of post war Czech glass, I can see what he means, we are both searching for another country and manufacturer, although I think Marcus is on the better trail and will post on that vase when he is ready.

Thanks again, excellent pictures

Adam
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on November 06, 2005, 11:42:01 AM
Hi Adam,

Thanks as always for your interesting comments.  You are absolutely right - I've just checked in the Miller's book and it is identical, even down to the measurement!?!? :?   It looks good and quite at home with my ever increasing collection of Czech vases :P  (11 bullet vases at the last count plus others :roll:  

Many thanks to you and Marcus for your excellent continuing research 8)  

Regards - Anne E.B. :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on November 06, 2005, 12:29:47 PM
Adam - just checked the markings on the base again.  In the centre of the star/circle are the initials SF.  I could only see these using a jewellers eye glass.   Fidenza???

Anne E.B. :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: KevinH on November 06, 2005, 07:15:54 PM
With reference to the reference above (in Adam's post) regarding "Royal Bohemia", there have been extensive discussions on this at:

http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,746.0.html
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: ChrisH on November 07, 2005, 07:44:26 PM
First of all, what a brilliant resource this messageboard is - I've been through several threads & read every word today - it's refreshing to read constant intelligent comments & insightful debate.

Untangling post-war Czech glass has to be one of the toughest assignments around, but I've seen evidence of more knowledge here than in any article I've read or website I've visited, so it's a privilege to join this forum.

Now hopefully I can add a few nuggets of my own! The first of these 2 images shows a pair of vases I picked up sometime last year. There was the remains of a label on one - 'emia' being the only legible portion, so I'm assuming they're Bohemian! They're 7" tall, & 2" wide including the relief. Interestingly, although they are clearly a pair the pattern is clearly much more sharply defined on one than the other, where the hobnails are more rounded - this I imagine comes from casting in a cold mould, whereas the more sharply defined was likely made later in the day?

(http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/8471/sklo017vk.th.jpg) (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sklo017vk.jpg)

The 2nd design I believe is also from the same region: it has commonalities with the Bullet - mainly the base, but it's the only one I've ever seen. There's a very subtle taper (which I hope is evident in the photo, I tried for a perfect side-on shot but it rarely happens!) which levels off about half way down the vase & might actually swing out again before curving to the base, it's hard to tell. It's 7" tall & a shade under 4" at its widest. I'd be interested to know if anyone's seen this pattern before?

(http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/8834/sklo029uy.th.jpg) (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sklo029uy.jpg)

Many thanks, ChrisH
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on November 07, 2005, 08:32:32 PM
Hi ChrisH,
Welcome to the board. Of your vases, are the green ones with a pronounced base-well, or nearly flat? The reason for differing definition could be that one may have been reheated following moulding. I have recently seen these in amber also, but would be hesitant to say which works produced them. Sorry, I have no idea on your blue piece.
regards,
Le Casson
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on November 08, 2005, 09:34:43 PM
Hi Anne

Sorry for not getting back, I have been working (sigh!!)

J Millers Collectable guide 2004 pp283

Now see an explosion in published interest with three whole pages in the 2006 guide pp332 – 334 (I don’t endorse price guide attributions, but this is a three page feature with paragraphs all on Sklo Union glass)

On page 332 there is our mystery vase again with a definite attribution to one of the Sklo Union factories. All but one of the 19 pictures has been supplied by GC which stands for the ‘Graham Cooley Collection’ I am not sure if it is a private collection, it looks like it may be

It is Graham who provides the confusing wavy line mystery vase. It has caused me to do some research. It would appear different markings appear on the base of two vases in raised letters a) ‘Italy’ with SF b) ‘Fidenza Italy’, c) there is also third version with no markings at all

This is a link to the ‘Fidenza Italy’ vase – see Anne’s post for ‘Italy’ version
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/sklo1.jpg
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/sklo2.jpg base markings

I have Graham Cooley’s email and will use it, as we have two vases with ‘Italy’ to base (I am sure now that Anne’s vase is also Fidenza, just a different marking?) and think that the vase with no markings could either be by Fidenza as well or perhaps there was a design sharing thing going on between Sklo and Fidenza Italy at the time (well :? ). I have emailed the Fidenza Company who now make glass blocks for interior designers and they tell me that they made these vases in the 1970s along with many other designs
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/fidenza.jpg both Fidenza, amazing differences in the design, the one on the right is deco and has a aqua tint to it, it is marked ‘Fidenza Italy’ which is in the Emilia Romagna area of Italy

In the meantime if anyone has any information, please post. I will get back after Graham emails me with info (is he on the board already?)

I get the feeling he is big in glass research, in fact reading the article I know he is! http://www.cambridgeglassfair.com/exhibitors/interviewarchive/int-cooley-graham.htm

I get pages with articles about Whitefriars and Stennett-Willson by Mr.Cooley, but nothing much on Sklo Union

I will also try picking his brains as to who put together such extensive research on Sklo for the price guide, I would love to scan it and link to it but that is copyright breach and I want to ask his help

I am sure there is a lot of his input in the copy – most of it is backing up the excellent posts that Marcus has initiated or contributed to on the GMB

‘In 1965, the Rudolfova Hut, Hermanova Hut, Libochovice, Rosice, and other glassworks were incorporated into the ‘Sklo Union’, the Czech national glass manufactory. The name ‘Royal Bohemia’ or ‘Bohemia Glass’ are labels applied by importers and exporters to Sklo Union glass’

There are six more paragraphs along with a lot of writing next to each picture; I am too tired to write it all

Designers names are given and even pattern numbers

There is a quarter page given to the ‘Bullet’ vase

Included are designs by Frantisek Peceny for Hermonova (Dragon Head Vase), Frantisek Visner designs, Rudolf Jurnikl tapered vase for Rudolfova (patt no.13155)
I own some of the vases pictured

A Rosice candlestick by Vladisav Urban
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/vu1.jpg

A Sklo Union vase first made in 1925 and still used up until late 1970’s
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/1925.jpg
Here is a good point the book makes (Marcus has been telling us for years) ‘It is estimated that in 1965, half the moulds being used in Sklo Union were of pre-war origin’ It may look old but they continued to use a huge amount of designs, what looks deco may be 1970s’

A Sklo Union vase that may be designed by Vaclav Hanus
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/vh.jpg

The Pineapple vase - tapering cylindrical with moulded hobnail like pyramidal prunts
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/sklo3.jpg

There are many more, and this time unlike in 2004 it is at pains to state many vases have ‘Royal Bohemia’ labels on but as said this is the importer label not the manufacturer within the Union

I know it’s very little new information for the hardcore Czech glass researcher, but this is a popular book and will clearly increase interest in the area

This one was in the 2004 edition; I presume it is Sklo even though it is not in 2006 edition
http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/royalboh.jpg

Here is one not in the book, I posted a few weeks ago and am looking forward to research http://hometown.aol.co.uk/blackcatgla/images/bluflower.jpg

I am sure there will be much more to look into. Marcus is fantastic and I don’t know anyone with more knowledge, a lot he has said is ‘BANG’ starting to get attention, I would like some of these guys like Graham Cooley to come onto the board as it takes the heat of everyone asking Marcus and I know he is busy with research.

All this is great for the seller/dealer I know, but I am not bothered about that, things are starting to come out and that is good for research, prices will find there own level in time I believe

I agree with Kev H have a look at the posts he has linked to above, the information Marcus gives is amazing, now all we need is a book on Sklo!! (no pressure Marcus, it’s just I would buy it LOL)

I hope I have not made too many mistakes or offended anyone in this post and please excuse any spelling or grammatical errors


Adam P
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on November 08, 2005, 10:15:53 PM
Thanks Adam, for the blush-worthy praise.
However, I should point out that for the 2006 Millers guide, I did act as their consultant on Sklo Union and as you rightly observe, many of the pieces came from the collections of Graham Cooley and Mark Hill.
There is a major problem with the vase of which you speak, seen elsewhere with the Italy mark. This is genuinely believed to have originated as a Teplice vase, probably designed by Vizner. Hearsay, as unreliable as it is, suggests that this was "copied" by Fidenza, possibly within months.
If there are errors of attribution, they are mine, and not the responsibility of Millers Collectables. All pattern numbers that I supplied are traceable.
Regards,
Marcus
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on November 08, 2005, 10:29:04 PM
Hi Adam,

My goodness you've been busy!  Really interesting stuff 8)   No wonder you're tired :P  

Coincidentally, just browsing through new (to me) websites earlier tonight and recognised your  blue Sklo Union vase.  Unable to understand German, but here it is - click on no. 23 http://www.designhandlung.de/sites/start_g.php Some other interesting pieces also.

I'm just about to get my hands on Millers' 2005 book, but will have to get  their latest too :P .

Regards - Anne E.B. :wink:
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on November 08, 2005, 10:37:14 PM
Marcus

I wondered why the J Miller 2006 section on Sklo was so good, congratulations I am so glad it was you, I thought it was so precise and will now dispel so many of the myths, but imagine a whole book (yum)!!

Ref Italian vase

Quote
This is genuinely believed to have originated as a Teplice vase, probably designed by Vizner. Hearsay, as unreliable as it is, suggests that this was "copied" by Fidenza, possibly within months.


Sounds good to me, I am not going to question your research, this will be the reason for the vases with no markings, what a great story I wonder how many other Fidenza vases were copied from Sklo or other sources, Fidenza did a great job, nice heavy crystal like glass, but now you tell me the story I see the base is different on the Italian ones, the base rim is not ground down (this is the same with all my Fidenza vases), is that right? I have not got an unmarked Sklo one on me (or I can’t find it in all my boxes) but I am sure the base rim is ground down in typical Sklo fashion

Well done again, I hope people buy the book as Sklo Union is such a good section and gives so much information in three pages, the bullet vase info is top notch, but all the other stuff, I can't believe I had so many of the items you referenced  :D

Adam P
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: David555 on November 08, 2005, 10:41:14 PM
Thanks Anne

That is a great site, thanks

Isn't the Sklo / Fidenza vase story amazing - Marcus is really on the ball, I wonder if our Fidenza versions are worth more - after all they are Italian :wink:

Adam P
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on November 08, 2005, 10:43:30 PM
Interesting site as you observe, Anne, but item 74 is clearly identified in the Crystalex publication Bohemian Glass  1985, (image 143) as being the work of Oldrich Lipsky, @ 1960, rather than Hlava, as stated here, but this site is not alone in making that attribution.
Regards,
Marcus
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne on November 10, 2005, 02:16:29 AM
Quote from: Anne E.B.
Coincidentally, just browsing through new (to me) websites earlier tonight and recognised your  blue Sklo Union vase.  Unable to understand German, but here it is - click on no. 23 http://www.designhandlung.de/sites/start_g.php

There's an English version of the sites too Anne 8)

Moderator:  Site links no longer show this piece
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Frank on May 17, 2006, 01:15:23 PM
Update after archiving:

Quote from: "LeCasson"
The items identified as Frantisek Zemek, are definitely identified as Frantisek Vizner (vase and variants) and documented in Warmus’s book on Vizner
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Della on July 16, 2006, 05:04:16 PM
Hi All.  :D

I found this vase today and I think that it is Sklo Union. I have been to Marcus' site to look, but some of the photos aren't loading for me.

(http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10026/thumb_skloyellow.jpg) (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2585)(http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/albums/userpics/10026/thumb_skloyellowbase.jpg) (http://glassgallery.yobunny.org.uk/displayimage.php?pos=-2584)
 :shock: Click to enlarge :shock:

Any and all is appreciated.
TIA  :P

Contrary to the photos, this piece is actually yellow
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Pip on July 16, 2006, 06:30:49 PM
Hi Della, I have a lilac one the same, I'd say it was definitely Sklo Union but I'm sure you'd like to hear that from Marcus.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne E.B. on July 16, 2006, 07:33:31 PM
Hi Della :lol:  Info in the thread "Emerald Green Czech Vases - REVISITED" (can't copy/paste for some reason).  ID'd by Peter and confirmed by Marcus as being made by Rudolfova Hut, part of Sklo Union, designed by Rudolf Shrotter.  I've got one in yellow. :wink:

LINK ADDED  http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,2038.0.html
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: vidrioguapo on July 16, 2006, 08:11:16 PM
They come in a whole range of colours - I have an aqua and an amber - would love to know how many colours in the full range - anyone know?

Emmi
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on July 19, 2006, 09:33:36 PM
Hi,
definitely found in:
Amber, citrine, green, aqua, flint, amethyst, aubergine, cobalt.
Varying degrees of colour due to daily melts, availability of colouring substances.
regards,
Marcus
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne on January 22, 2008, 11:38:55 PM
As Marcus is positively bubbling with new info I've moved this back into Glass pro temps so it can be updated if there's any new info.
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on January 31, 2008, 10:23:50 AM
Hi,
Thanks for bumping this Anne, clearly some revisions to be made.....
So:
David Encill's initial two green vases (p1) are from the Rosice factory, but not Schrotter, pattern number 974.
David's second pair of images, the blue wavy vase is again Rosice, pattern number 1272, but definitely not by Frantisek Vizner, as confirmed by the artist himself, therefore designer unknown.
Adam's (David555) pair of images from the same page, the left hand vase, is Sklo Union but pattern number unknown, and tho' I think I know who designed it, and which factory made it, I am not prepared to comment until confirmed. The right hand vase, still remains unidentified, and even with the massive increase in information in the Sklo Union database, (now at almost 3,000 items) I am still of the opinion that this may be Polish or Scandinavian.
Regards,
Marcus

Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Anne on January 31, 2008, 04:09:22 PM
Thanks Marcus. (I have an interest in this topic now as I picked up a vase like David's first page green ones, but in yellow, recently. It'd be nice to know who/where/when etc. :))
Title: Re: Emerald-green Czech vases - REVISITED
Post by: Sklounion on January 31, 2008, 05:51:45 PM
When is 1960/61.
Regards,
Marcus