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Glass Discussion & Research. No ID requests here please. => Bohemia, Czechoslovakia, Czech Republic, Austria => Topic started by: turquoisepetal on June 13, 2010, 11:53:14 AM

Title: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: turquoisepetal on June 13, 2010, 11:53:14 AM
Hi

Just bought this from our local carboot, one of my local dealers has a stall and sells things fairly cheaply.

It is a pulled vase with a scene etched on it of a dragonfly, looks like it is signed M under the etching. I believe it is a Zelezny brod vase and not a mstisov due to the softness of the lines and colour.

The vase weights a massive 2 kilos and is 8" high and 10" at the widest part. I have just looked in HI Sklo lo Sklo and it is not in there. I am just about to buy Marcus book on sklo glass as I am find allsort of sklo glass at the moment. 

If anyone can help that would be great.

Regards

sam
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 13, 2010, 02:13:08 PM
Hi Sam,
I'd be very surprised if this vase were Czech.  I really don't know very much about glass since I'm just a beginner, but it seems to me that the thickness of the glass, the shape of the vase and the quality of the etching is not Czech.  I wonder what our knowledgable members will say about your vase?  It will be interesting to find out.

Anik
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 04:51:33 PM
Hi Anik,

I do believe that this is sklo union and I do Believe it is by either Mstisov or Srklovice or Zelezny ( Miloslav Kinger)

The shape and the thickness is typical of blown glass and the colouring is about right too! i don't think it is English, Italian or scandinavian either. The etching on the vase appears to be like Tockstein ( who enjoy taking influence from nature) see page 124 of Hi Sklo low Sklo.

Anyway thanks again for your comments they are greatly appreciated

Paul

www.milliesantiques.co.uk
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 13, 2010, 05:48:28 PM
Hi Paul...

So I really am surprised if this is indeed a Zelezny Brod vase.  I see a world of difference between Sam's vase and those which have been attributed to ZB glassworks.   It looks too wonky -- the rim is different to anything I've seen, and the engraving (especially of the lily pads) is very uneven and almost child-like.

Hmmmm... 

But then again, someone will surely come along and prove me wrong...  And that's OK -- all part of the learning process.  ;D
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 05:56:07 PM
Well I suppose I could be wrong! It only cost 6 pound and I am pretty sure I can make a very handsome profit who ever it my be!
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 13, 2010, 06:00:50 PM
Hi Sam...  I've got a request...  could you post another picture of the vase, this time with a full face view? (What I mean is, without a top angle...) 

Thank you  :)
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 06:03:17 PM
Ok will do, just cooking a BBQ at the moment.
Oh by the way Sam is my better half.

Paul
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Ivo on June 13, 2010, 06:09:57 PM
Strikes me immediately as ZBS - so not Sklo Union.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 13, 2010, 06:19:46 PM
Thank you, Ivo...  I did not register Paul's use of 'Sklo Union' when discussing the vase  :-[   

Ivo, are you sure it's ZBS?  Doesn't it look just a little wrong?  I really do think I've been sitting in front of my screen just a tad too long.  My eyes are obviously playing tricks on me.  ;)

Anik
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 06:22:53 PM
Here is the full on image you have asked for Anik. I did not even realise that ZBS was not part of the Sklo union. You learn something new everyday.

Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 13, 2010, 06:42:43 PM
Ahhhh...  From this angle, the vase looks MUCH better...  and now we can even see the lovely colors.  I'm afraid your previous photos did not do the glass justice.

Ok, so the vase is not wonky.  :pb:  My greatest apologies!

ZBS it is.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Nemmie on June 13, 2010, 07:04:15 PM
Sklo union factories only produced pressed glass.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 07:13:27 PM
Oh thank you.  I did not know that
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: astrid on June 13, 2010, 07:41:41 PM
I vote Czech, but I'm not sure which company. It haven't seen exactly this form so far in ZBS pieces from Klinger, neither the use of 2 different colours. It might be an early piece, or by a different maker (like Zemek? The colour use reminds me a bit of the Rhapsody and Harmony pieces by him for Mstisov). The engraving does remind me more of ZBS, though.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 13, 2010, 08:14:13 PM
I do agree with zemek idea. The engraving has got me foxed tho. There is the inital Z underneath one of the lillys. The colours seem to be very soft and lines seem to flow, maybe it could be one of zemek's protege's like Machovska. Anyway I love it.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Jindra8526 on June 14, 2010, 05:49:10 AM
Ah Got, I see you have total chaos in Czechoslovakian glassworks.
Possibly ZBS, not Zemek, never Machovsk√° and Mstisov. I would not try to look for any great designer, engraving is very simple and stupid.

Jindrich
www.webareal.cz/ceskoslovenskesklo
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 14, 2010, 06:27:04 AM

engraving is very simple and stupid.


Jindrich, you are a cruel man...  :24:  And I thought I was being rude, calling the engraving 'child-like'.
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Jindra8526 on June 14, 2010, 07:11:10 AM
That is what I exactly wanted to say Anik but my Czenglish is so poor :-)

Jindrich
www.webareal.cz/ceskoslovenskesklo
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 14, 2010, 08:40:13 AM
This is fun! I don't think the photos of the engraving do it any justice. They are mainly a tad out of focus it is very difficult photographing engraving under a bounced flash. I do love the open discussion you get on the gmb. Well I'll just have to keep looking for that Czech masterpiece then but I will find it!!!!!

Paul
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Jindra8526 on June 14, 2010, 09:15:08 AM
Isn't it the same fly?  ;D

Jindrich
www.webareal.cz/ceskoslovenskesklo
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 14, 2010, 09:24:14 AM
Yep that's the fly. Who is it?
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: Anik R on June 14, 2010, 11:01:37 AM
I don't think the photos of the engraving do it any justice.

Hi Paul,

While I do think your original photos did not do the vase any justice, the engraving is another story...  I really don't mean any disrespect, but the engraving is crude.  The lines on the lillies are jagged and much deeper than the other bits.  The flower (lotus?) is uneven and lop-sided...  I've been looking at a lot of Czech pieces lately, including ZBS engraved vases.  I really haven't seen any engraved example as poorly executed as yours. 

I wonder what the story behind that is?   My lovely imagination can just picture an old, tired engraver, with shaky hands from lack of alcohol, and an eye-infection to boot... 

 :kissy:
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 14, 2010, 12:35:16 PM
No offence taken! I don't know a great deal about engraving on zbs. So any info is great and will aid resale of the piece.

Paul
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: chopin-liszt on June 14, 2010, 05:48:02 PM
I thought the lily leaves looked as if they'd been drawn in lots of straight sections with a ruler........
Title: Re: Id request for Zelezny brod ?
Post by: surfersam on June 14, 2010, 07:41:48 PM
It looks to me that the lillys were a after thought or the engraver found a bottle of spirits left over from the Xmas party. The dragonfly is lovely and I think engraved really well!!! ( before he found the booze)

I am starting to wish I never put the bothery thing on here Know!! Lol! I only wanted to now the model number!!!!

So if you see the vase in our store, with the description. It will read something like this:

A lovely, large, heavy and striking ZBS vase.
With a bit of a joke engraving of a dragonfly and some drunk lillies.

With thanks to the Gmb.

Hahaha
cheers

Paul