Glass Discussion & Research. NO IDENTIFICATION REQUESTS here please. > USA

FAKE Northwood 'Grape & Cable' Carnival Glass

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David E:
NOTE: The earlier postings didn't assume the glass was fake.

Following on from the other thread, following are some photos of the green Northwood 'Grape & Cable' dish/bowl ('sans' stippling :wink:)

EDIT: Click thumbnails to enlarge  :oops:

:

It features a frilled and notched 'pie-crust' rim and a footed base with the letter 'N' embossed in the centre. Absolutely pristine condition with not even any base wear — looks like it just walked out of the shop. It measures 8½" (21.5cm) diameter and 2" (5cm) tall.

My query concerns which category it falls into. The footed base makes me think "bowl" and according to David Doty's site this would appear to fall under the category "Bowls, 8-9 inches, pie crust edge".

Also, can anyone define the dates this bowl was produced.

Glen:
Well first the date - and the info comes from "Carnival Glass The Magic & The Mystery".

Grape and Cable was marketed in 1910 and I can find sporadic appearances as late as 1918. Harry Northwood passed away in 1919, and the company really didn't have the same impetus after his death as before, even though it limped on for a while.

The item you illustrate is a bowl with a piecrust edge. The base is called a "collar base" (your photo shows the marie).

Glen

David E:
Wow, thanks Glen – so no later than 1918. Amazing considering the condition it's in.  :D

OK, think I need to buy the book...  :wink:

David E:
Further to private mails with Glen, it has been determined that this piece is actually repro/fake :cry:

Glen has kindly provided a link to demonstrate the differences:

http://www.geocities.com/carni_glass_uk_2000/FakeGCable.html

So when I stated "... looks like it just walked out of the shop." I wasn't wrong!  :evil:

Glen:
David and I have been emailing and swapping info on this most interesting Grape and Cable fake. It’s a wonderful “educational” piece and a real talking point.

He has taken some excellent photos of the base that show one of the main characteristics of the Far Eastern fakes - the simple bold letter N.

The original Northwood pieces that have the N mark have a letter N that is underlined and in a circle.

On the early fakes, the base (marie) was iridised. This is a way to spot most modern Carnival, but as a method of identification it needs to be treated with caution as rather a lot of European (old) Carnival also has traces of iridescence on the base. Most Classic, old USA Carnival will have no iridescence on the base.

But - David’s fake Grape & Cable has no iridescence on the base! The fakers have spotted that little trick (perhaps they’ve been reading my articles).

There is another tell-tale characteristic on David’s fake though - and his photos are the absolute very best I have seen of such a feature. The outer rim of the base is ground (polished). Note the original Northwood examples are not ground.

So, to sum up, the single most telling characteristic on the fakes (Grape & Cable, Good Luck, Peacocks) still seems to be that they have a bold letter N on the base. It is not underlined and is not in a circle. That’s the fake. The genuine Northwood pieces have the N underlined and in a circle.  Look also for a ground and polished rim to the base. That's not the old Northwood piece.

Thanks to David for his excellent photos that I am sure he will post to show everyone.

Glen

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