Topic: Another "how did they do that?" thread - carved vase with ? maker's mark

[krsilber]

Once again, I'm intrigued by a piece I can't quite figure out.  It's in a thread in the Ebay Pottery, Glass and Porcelain forum, and a few methods have been proposed for the way the texture was done - etching, sandblasting, wheel cut (nixed)...and my totally off the wall hypothesis that something (e.g. clay) was applied to the inside of a mold then tooled to create the features.  I don't really believe the hypothesis because I don't know if it's possible...is it even theoretically possible?

Here are links to photos of the piece:

http://www.spiretech.com/~argentpickle/lorraine%201.jpg
http://www.spiretech.com/~argentpickle/lorraine%202.jpg (inside view)
http://www.spiretech.com/~argentpickle/lorraine%204.jpg (bottom, which says Lorraine, France, and has a mark of sorts)
http://www.spiretech.com/~argentpickle/lorraine%205.jpg (another bottom shot)

And a link to the thread:  http://forums.ebay.com/db2/thread.jspa?messageID=520365204&#520365204

Thanks for any input!

[Tigerchips]

The mark in the centre is probably the 'FBS' mark.
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,183.0.html

[Frank]

It looks like the mould was decorated with acid etching.

Well spotted on the FBS mark, almost certainly 30s

[KevinH]

I was also wondering about the central portion being an "FBS" mark - but why would it have "Trade Mark" added? If the "FBS" - as it appears in the various ones we know about - was a general requirement for import to (perhaps) the USA, then it seems odd that one version would be stated as a trade mark.

[Frank]

It isn't an import mark, has to be a wholesaler retailer. So far Trade Mark searches have got nowhere, but more are being added all the time so one day it should show up. Never tried to find it as a Canadian trade mark though...

The acid mark bears no relationship to any of the listed Lorraine marks so must be our old friend again. Perhaps some work with graphite will show up some more of the mark to prove it is the FBS one.

That trade mark has been added is useful but almost every possible variation in how the mark is done has been seen. This example does tend to prove the mark was added by the glass works rather than the importer... although that was already fairly obvious in that the actual design used was consistent per glassworks.

Back to the vase:

Verame used their name as their mark with a large V and the rest vertical down the right of the V.

Verrerie d'Art Lorraine is almost certainly right for this, set up by one of Daum's to produce cheap mass volume including cameo, but the cameo had distinctive markings. The patterning is more consistent with acid etched metal mould rather than etched glass. Are the clear portions raised or depressed. Technique is the same, apply resist and etch but using a different acid.

Search on the board for more about the technique.

[Frank]

Not really a good match in end result but happened to be close to hand - here is a quick web cam shot of acid etched mould decoration, in this case US c1880 Riverside "Goddess of the Hunt" salver. Patented US technique known as Crystalograph.

[krsilber]

The clear areas are in relief, raised from the surroundings.  I'm familiar with etched molds (they're common in Depression glass), but to me this doesn't seem like etching (alone at least) of either the glass or the mold.  With etching I'd expect to see "flat" areas of different depths corresponding with the amount of time the mold/glass was in the acid.  The topography doesn't look right to me for that, but maybe there's a process I don't know about.  The OP describes it like canyon walls in miniature.  And the edges of the blank areas are quite sharp, another thing I wouldn't expect with an etched mold.  Wouldn't it have to have been pressed to get detail like this to show?  Yet there are no mold marks, and you'd think in the process of eliminating them you'd end up getting rid of sharpness in the design.

With sandblasting, on the other hand, you might be able to aim the stream enough to give it more of a carved look.  That could be followed by etching to polish it.

As for the mark, I don't get the FBS thing.  All I see is a 5 (possibly an S).  Am I missing something?

And Verame - a poster who claimed he knew whereof he spoke said Verame was a mystery, and no one even knew for sure whether the company was Czech or French.  Is it a mystery?  Is Verame = Verrerie d'Art Lorrain?

[Frank]

No, Verame is a French company making etched and cut glass in the 1930s next to nothing else in Hartmann with reference to dealer source 

[Tigerchips]

Clearly the same stamp as this one...
http://www.glassmessages.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=183.0;attach=10241;image

...that one doesn't have the word 'TRADEMARK' underneath it though.

[KevinH]

Well found! Yes, the circle with dots and diamonds is the same.

As Frank said, some time we surely must find some info on this mark and all the variations.