Topic: Cased Glass Rose Bowl Id Help Needed

[obscurities]

In looking at the additional pictures, the exterior no longer appears to be satin glass to me. I think I lean towards cased glass also....

[azelismia]

actually, I'd like to add one clarification to My first post on this. I said it was not Webb, what I meant is that it's not Webb Peachblow, it could still be webb but just as a cased glass, it could also be stevens and williams or john walsh walsh or something like that.

[krsilber]

The fact that the lower part glows supports the idea that it's shaded rather than heat-sensitive.  The rosy glass is thin enough toward the bottom that you're seeing the inner layer through it.

I agree with Christine that there's no reason to think these pieces were decorated by the same person.  There's nothing particularly difficult about the style or method, with the possible exception of the birds, but even that wouldn't be tough to learn with a little practice.

the thorny handles looks very English to me.

Mt. Washington also made handles like this.

I have a photo of a blue-shaded ewer attributed to MW with a very similar decoration, including birds of the same colors, but different species.  I don't know for sure that it is MW, but it's from the same mold as this one, also attributed to MW:  http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=290331041121.  FWIW, the shaded blue and rose colors match those seen in Avila's The Pairpoint Glass Story.  

There's also this photo (posted previously in another thread) from Corning Museum of a MW biscuit jar with the same round red beads (though the decoration is different).

None of this is strong evidence of anything, but may be worth considering.

[azelismia]

Kristi, the ebay link you sent is a pretty common shape but I've never seen it in an actual mt washington book. I've seen this shape and a couple very very similar shapes attributed to everyone under the sun. I don't think there is anything out there solid to support it though. I've never seen one of these with a mark or referenced in a book. It could be mt washington. I tend to have an expectation from the top glass houses to have a bit more detail in the birds when they are present than these have but I don't think it's a hard and fast rule. Mt washington in particular didn't always have top notch decorators. their better lines did but they also had lines that weren't quite as detailed.

[Lustrousstone]

Well the inside white layer is definitely uranium and the pink outside is a casing that disappears to nothing at the bottom, so not a heat reactive effect.

I suspect it could be from almost anywhere; an eight-way crimp is very common, as is a cased effect, in rose bowls. Unless we can find an accurately attributed one with those handles, we're probably going to be out of luck with an ID.

I have to say that I am  :mrgreen:

Here's a nice link on rose bowls http://www.mirror.org/harrymcgee/rosebowl.html

Has anyone got Johanna Billings' book Collectible Glass Rose Bowls?

[Bernard C]

Clarification, please.   I am getting the impression that it is believed that temperature sensitive glass has to contain either uranium or gold.   This just isn't the case.   Hajdamach recognised in his book that Walsh Crushed Strawberry, launched in November 1883, was temperature-sensitive glass.   We now know that the formula for Crushed Strawberry contains neither uranium nor gold.   The faint response you get to UV in examples of Walsh Crushed Strawberry is from the inner layer of pale apple green that Walsh used.   We also know that within a few years the formula for Crushed Strawberry was known in the United States, and, as it was most likely being spread by consultative raw material representatives, we can assume that it became general knowledge worldwide quite quickly.

We don't know whether Walsh made a shaded version of Crushed Strawberry like Peach-blow and Burmese, but I would be surprised if they hadn't experimented with it.   Possibly patents prevented them from going into production here.   Lining up my four quite variable examples of Walsh Crushed Strawberry with my mystery decorated ewer shows no substantial difference in surface colour, except that the ewer is shaded.

None of this helps to attribute these decorated pieces, except that a Bohemian glass house seems more and more likely.

Bernard C.  

[azelismia]

Bernard, why would any of that make a Bohemian glass house more likely than an English source? Frankly of the three examples provided it wouldn't surprise me to find that one was English one was Bohemian and one was American.

on crushed strawberry, this article says that the casing for crushed strawberry did include uranium and it was unclear if the pink part contained uranium

http://www.glassassociation.org.uk/Journal/uranium-4.htm


I actually think this article makes it very very likely that this piece IS walsh in a shaded varient.

[Ivo]

Has anyone got Johanna Billings' book Collectible Glass Rose Bowls?

I do - and I do remember all the endless discussions about rose bowls that led up to its publication. But I do not think the answer is available there....

[Bernard C]

...   on crushed strawberry, this article says that the casing for crushed strawberry did include uranium and it was unclear if the pink part contained uranium   ...

Skelcher clearly says:

...   These items are made of at least two layers of metal and the uranium is not in the prominent strawberry or blue! They are examples of where expensive uranium glass has been used unnecessarily.   ...

He is clear that the uranium is in the inner layer, but hadn't seen an example of Crushed Strawberry where the pontil mark had been ground down to the inner layer, the only way I know of detecting its pale apple green colour.

Bernard C. 

[azelismia]

right, that doesn't differ from what I said. cased shaded glass is still cased glass. the inner layer can be one thing and the outer layer another, this particular rosebowl is clearly a case of that. the pink part does not react to the black light but the inner case does. the outside of the glass may appear to be glowing but that could be the inner layer showing thru a clear to pink shaded glass on the outside. the pink doesn't react to the blacklight indicating there is no uranium present in that mix. the pink does match the crushed strawberry look, and it is a uranium liner. It isn't crushed strawberry as that was not a shaded varient but there is no reason they wouldn't have made a shaded version, it was very popular at the time and the styling of this piece is very walsh like. I personally think Walsh is the frontrunner for this piece. I wonder if Dave (mr vaseline glass) has seen this one before.

(btw, I probably shouldn't be posting and hope I am making sense this afternoon, i am running on fumes. we're in the middle of moving and stayed up all night getting ready for movers.