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Author Topic: 'Unusual' pink opalescent girasol antique creamer, facet cut, cased- show& tell  (Read 4541 times)

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Offline flying free

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Interesting becher in pink translucent glass cased in clear
listed as probably Annathal bei Schüttenhofen, 1850-1860.
The pink seems appears more intense than that on my creamer and I suspect it is not opalescent however worth adding for future reference:

https://www.the-saleroom.com/de-de/auction-catalogues/dr-fischer/catalogue-id-fischer10014/lot-49ad4f2e-8ca3-4847-9a86-a5b600ef0d61

also another piece here from Moser c.1880 with a similar pink translucent underlay cased in clear but a very different shape.  This is more similar to the effect perceived on the creamer however I am sure the shape of the creamer could date it to first half 19th:
https://www.the-saleroom.com/de-de/auction-catalogues/dr-fischer/catalogue-id-fischer10009/lot-c9247b78-08e5-42d6-99bf-a4ac00ff9b8d

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These are very similar to the jug - if you're interested you will need to click and enlarge the image to see the similarities.
Looking at the colour of them also possibly dichroic given the tinge of peach to the pink.  Also cased in clear,also with the white stripes down them.

Sold 21 March 2020 by Dr Fischer auction with the following description:

'Lot 457 | Two handle vases with an Oriental version of decor Two handle vases with an Oriental version of decor Colorless, pink collected glass, with side-mounted handles. Many faceted wall with ornamental decor for Arabian models in Gold. H. 36 cm. Comparable vases have been exported around 1870, among other things, by the count's Josephine glassworks in Szklarska poręba (Silesian) Schaffgot'.
Source: https://veryimportantlot.com/en/lot/view/zwei-henkelvasen-mit-orientalisierendem-dekor-303998'



https://veryimportantlot.com/en/lot/view/zwei-henkelvasen-mit-orientalisierendem-dekor-303998

https://veryimportantlot.com/cache/lot/303998/736061_1583339958-563x367_width_50.jpg?_=1583339958

So possibly Josephinenhutte

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Link to a fantastic image of a Buquoy agatinglas becher - you can enlarge it brilliantly and clearly to see all the detail:

https://imkinsky.com/de/kaufen/ergebnisse/107/4.501/59995-fussbecher

My jug image link:
https://www.glassmessages.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=64586.0;attach=202723;image

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Offline Ekimp

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On pages 46 to 49, Hajdamach shows some pages from the Webb Richardson pattern book, c.1830s. I assume the colour is completely wrong, but have you noticed the similarity of the cutting on your jug to the jug shown middle left of plate 30? I have a salt or sugar that I think is from the same family as it wouldn’t look out of place on plate 37, and I think it looks very bohemian but it’s clear. Interesting, if nothing else!
People say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day - Winnie-the-Pooh

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mm, jugs are quite difficult but I don't think that shape is at all similar  :-[  The eye sees things so differently doesn't it though?

You know, I'm often wrong on these things probably because instinct is not always a good thing  ;D but in my defence sometimes it's just a good place to start searching.



Sometimes it just comes down to looking at something and thinking there's something Bohemian about the cutting, the style, the colour etc. Or there is a design that just isn't Bohemian somehow.  So as an example the jugs on page 56 of that CH book.  In the drawings they are Richardson's, panel cut, green coloured in the actual drawings, and yes the right hand one does have a panel cut jutting out collar as does my pink jug.  However, overall there's something not Bohemian about it if you see what I mean. And then when you look at the picture of the decanter on page 53 that is the decanter version of the green jug on the left on page 56.  In real life it doesn't look Bohemian to me at all.





There is more of a problem with the items on page 57 of that book that explain this predicament quite well:

- The amethyst scent bottle is gorgeous - I wouldn't have known that was English but equally would have been wondering about Bohemian not being quite right.  I might have thought it was French but the colour and cutting put me off, Bohemian maybe but the colour put me off.  So I might have considered English perhaps eventually but more likely might have though Russian first because of the colour and the design and then the cutting (but the fact that Russian glass is rare and the stopper might not be Russian in style would put me off).
- The amber scent bottle I would have put as Bohemian but wondered why it was so clunky and wondered about the horizontal line cutting around the rim of the cornucopia. CH has it as probably French.  That might explain the clunkiness (French style of that period appears to me to have a certain clunkiness about it) but I would never have put the foot as French so still might query that as French.  That foot is Bohemian to me. So is the colour. The stopper is something that was used in Bohemian glass as well.
-  And then there's uranium yellow cut glass bowl ... I've noted he does not say where he thinks that was made.  I'm in many minds about that bowl  ;D  I love that bowl but cannot place it except to say the foot looks Bohemian to me but difficult to tell. 





Conversely, my jug is pink cased in clear (probably not English then in my mind - but thinking Buquoy'sche glas as they were renowned for their development of amazing colours ); it's panel cut in a particular style all over that immediately says Bohemian Biedermeier period to me but could be later; has a foot cut in a particular way that is seen on many many bechers of that period (Bohemian), and has a large polished pontil mark (thinking Annathal bei Schuttenhofen - Bohemian).  So at the end of the day there isn't anything about my jug that would make me look at English makers ... but I could be wrong! 






Just my opinion but the problem is I think, that these coloured glass items were 'fashionable' all over Europe during this period. Fashionable being 'desirable' by buyers.  They'd gone off clear glass of the 'death by a thousand cuts' style (see page 43 of that book for some lovely examples) although the critics were still pushing the clarity of the lovely English glass etc.  v the Bohemian clear glass not judged to be as good quality. 

English glassmakers had a problem with tax issues which constrained how well they could compete in making coloured glass etc. 

The Bohemian's took the opportunity to make enormous developments in coloured glass and cutting styles to show the best of those colour and technique developments and exported tons of it.  Many tons of it.  Hence there are so many good examples around still. 

French glassmakers were making the most beautiful coloured glass from early in the 1800s as well.  I have one piece that is amazing.  Check out also 'gorge de pigeon' glass.  It was truly the most beautiful opaline. But that said, my heart belong to the Bohemian glass of this period.  The colours, the cutting techniques, the engraving, the enamelling.  All on one becher.  Incredible stuff and beautiful designs.  Breaking new ground.




I do think English glassmakers were developing coloured glass techniques and ideas but for whatever reason the first half of the 1800s belong to Biedermeier glass.


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One more comment :)

On English cased glass.
In the following article David Whitehouse makes a comment  on the last page in Note 7. pp 260:

'The earliest evidence for the manufacture of cased glass in the United Kingdom is designs in an 1844 pattern book of W.H., B. &  J. Richardson of Stourbridge.  Richardson exhibited cased glass at the Exposition of British Industrial Art in Manchester 1845-1846: Charles R. Hajdamach, British Glass 1800-1914, Woodbridge, Suffolk, UK. '

My jug is cased and I believe is from an earlier period.


Source:
JOURNAL ARTICLE
John Biddle, Apsley Pellatt, and the Portland Vase
David Whitehouse
Journal of Glass Studies
Journal of Glass Studies
Vol. 54 (2012), pp. 259-261 (3 pages)
Published by: Corning Museum of Glass

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Offline Ekimp

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Interesting reply thanks :D I haven’t got my eye-in in anyway approaching your experience and tend to think anything deeply cut and colourful is bohemian, but some of what I read and see is sinking in. I seem to have acquired a small collection of bohemian (type?) glass.

As you had said about the colour on your jug in your research I wasn’t suggesting it was British as thought the colour ruled that out, but thought it was interesting how similar (in my eye ;D ) it was to your jug. With the comparison to the jug, middle left on Plate 30, it is a different shape being conical but I thought the cutting looked quite like yours being facet cut and with the raised cut ring around the body. Also, I thought the handle looked very similar in shape and being cut on the sides and possibly blended into the body. The treatment of the facets on the body each side of the lower handle attachment looks identical to yours. Although a different shape, it does have a recessed cut ring just above the bottom. I thought if you did a line drawing of your jug, it wouldn’t look out of place in the Webb Richardson pattern book...maybe in the space above the jug with a rounded bottom  ;D
People say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day - Winnie-the-Pooh

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I wouldn't say I was experienced in any way. There is just too much of it and I've seen precious few museum collections in real life.  It comes as a surprise when something looks for example ethereal on screen only to see it in person and it weighs a ton.  Or vice versa more often.
I have a lot of books though and love researching and my peculiar love is for coloured glass 1800-1850.  Anything after 1850 and I'm not that interested unless it's 1910s-30s French/Czechoslovakian.  So it's quite a narrow field of interest  :-[

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