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Author Topic: Manchester Blues part 2  (Read 700 times)

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Offline Jeffingtons

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Manchester Blues part 2
« on: May 14, 2020, 02:44:05 PM »
Hi everyone.
Whilst researching John Derbyshire, I read this thread from a year.
https://www.glassmessages.com/index.php/topic,68422.msg380639.html#msg380639

Subsequently, my interest was piqued when I spotted this translucent blue vase for sale. It has a marked similarity to the blue vase in the original post in the rim and the decor and the base, though the stem is notably different.
(Edit: the sun/sunflower pattern is repeated in all three panels on my vase)

Height is 8¼ inches (21cm) tall and approx 350g in weight. Not overly worn to the base but equivalent to my Derbyshire vase (pictured for comparison).
Under UV light, there's the slightest ghost of a green glow but that could be my eyes as I can't pick it up on camera.

Interested to see where the discussion goes on this one. It's a pretty new area for me so thanks in advance for your thoughts.

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Offline neilh

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Re: Manchester Blues part 2
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2020, 04:59:30 PM »
I would say the odds on this being by the Derbyshires is pretty low, they tend to get put forward for these ornamental vases because they registered an ornamental rose, shamrock, thistle vase in 1872. A similar shape of vase was made as part of a service in two of their tableware sets, but as tableware, would only have been made in uranium, frosted, and clear. Therefore they only ever registered one purely ornamental vase like this, and not in this colour. Ker & Webb of Manchester also registered one ornamental vase of similar shape, a commemorative, and it is in this colour.

In pressed glass, it's relatively unusual for a company, particularly the smaller ones in Manchester, to plough the same furrow in a run of designs, due to the costs of the moulds. They tend to have one go at something, and if it is successful, competitors rapidly copy it.

So my approach with an unregistered piece like this would be to approximate the time period (1870-1885) and then list out all the manufacturers who were capable of making it. Then I would remove those who have registered a piece in the same ballpark.

For this one the Manchester contenders are James Derbyshire, John Derbyshire, Burtles Tate, Ker & Webb, Molineaux Webb, and Percival Vickers. I would exclude John Derbyshire, as having done other designs like this, and exclude Molineaux Webb and Percival Vickers, where there is no evidence of similar pieces at all. I would be tempted to suggest Ker & Webb as the most likely, a glass works of which we sadly know very little, although they ran a bigger factory than John Derbyshire, and for a lot longer time period.

This discussed the Manchester set but of course the larger works in the northeast made these sorts of pieces, Edward Moore is the key contender here, and overall I would favour Moore as the most likely.

Though of course 'tis a guess.

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Offline Jeffingtons

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Re: Manchester Blues part 2
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2020, 05:05:44 PM »
Thanks Neil for the in depth yet succinct assessment. It's all guesswork for me at the moment. 😄

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