Topic: Can anyone help with this piece? I think it's Sabino. I'm a newbie.

[chopin-liszt]

The mark on the bowl and on my butterfly are very similar - not written in the very fine line of a diamond pen, but something much thicker.

I can feel but not see, mould marks around the pedestal base, the edges of the wings and the front og the insect are mould seams, and are still a bit sharp; the pressing of the veins on the surface of the wings is blunt and worn.
I would suspect an old mould, and not finished off as well as old stuff would be.
I paid £80 for it. I think it was too much, even 20 years ago.

RobertM. Have a good feel all over and around edges of your bowl. See what your fingers can pick up that your eyes maybe can't. 

[RobertM]

Thank you for everyone's help. Since the dealer sold this as a 1930s piece and the Jobling piece found on Ebay, I returned it. I just wasn't comfortable keeping it at the price. Thank you again.

[RobertM]

This looks identical to the one I was sold

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jobling-Art-Deco-Cupped-Rim-Bowl/203190099504?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item2f4f12de30:g:RHIAAOSwloxfuNNq&amdata=enc%3AAQAFAAACcBaobrjLl8XobRIiIML1V4Imu%252Fn%252BzU5L90Z278x5ickkrmmq8hWevtuKE7%252F%252BLfVXtj5c13XlQ6Oa30R%252FnZ3WYMOohXmsAPLds1kza%252FApDIz6TsWAO8%252F1sFO2Fe52SuDtHCk7YZON0qyJkuxGObkc52A7P9WP22OwKtnAkBbuu8dUAMSLidwVsVOwA4HMOXPvXxgIg8H%252FSwpapUcuDyhSjmuPaY15KE%252FBIK2MoZMhpiLy2PFQwixeiydZuZX74gk%252FOrYm4UemHgI1YI%252F5DfJhOXzTYl6immOBcERBK5RQNO8qf89YoJULJGi2CrBtDa38mbS1xN%252BusLwepsVUlUgQPfGO%252F%252FkGJu5o00EYBAOD5nWobx%252FTVBQSL2uj4aSzdOKoIUWFbUgnQPocji4ryBfx5y51dWVJonC7ny%252B8pVwnHipco6ZZjV7Lmro1UTzwN%252BbKAkf4U1CSU1cyb3P9xKHa3yE0FNAkHXiiD%252Fr5qP3f7u9m7ghKlFG4xn0XzGgDG5M9v1BRlStDgowI059vA%252BiIJPgJAFnKUacU2kf78qP5n%252FFbRa1tWLSgoPULqCk2VoJfvrLXlmWK5CInKOzRMM3GusAeEI4i65m5%252BDA56tgm2QIR4lOjxFBrwhfUUg0IdBuLqIaWvlFsW%252Fg1U8qDyOa1%252BmySXZFE8yFdceZoiHPcx8g%252B7GuiZRgVGfG1P6VQC3PIO%252BFUdQN7%252FesWvlLODc3FxwXnmC4FPiah7zRoSDG35bECipwucOlcYdYqkhPdNCevSJkyDVYQdhET4PVL82OWhSRQtLvaAJI1u9k%252B3ywNo48SHzAO6zzyXC0I9RfYH8LqpA%253D%253D%7Ccksum%3A203190099504afc7c3170f864255bc46747a8549d20d%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2334524

[chopin-liszt]

It was definitely not from the '30s. Glad to hear your seller was decent about it. 

[Mosquito]

Definitely a Jobling Flower Pattern bowl with a likely spurious mark. From the strong, more whitish opalescence and apparent lack of a registration number, I'd think it was quite an early example (1932-3) of Jobling production. The mark was most probably added later to deceive. However, there is some history between the companies, as Jobling apparently did approach Sabino with the intention of producing Sabino designs under license in the UK, though apparently no agreement was made as Sabino wanted too much money. Jobling did copy Sabino's Les Hirondelles pattern though for their 2606 pintray...

As Sue has said, this broad engraved Sabino signature is more common on newer pieces. On the pieces I have which I can positively date as pre-war (shapes which haven't been re-issued, earlier colours/ finishes), the marks have either been moulded, diamond point incised, or engraved with a finer-tipped tool.

As for engraved marks on Jobling -- some opalescent pieces were marked "Jobling's" "Opalique" in engraved script from late 1933 onwards (the earliest piece thus marked that I have seen is a large lambton bird bowl). Some pieces also have engraved "Regn. Appld. For" marks, showing they were made before the design registration number was added to the mould.

The modern Sabino Crystal Company have reissued some old designs which were originally not sold under the Sabino name. From their current online catalogue, I recognise an Etling figure and vase, as well as two bowl designs which were previously sold under the 'Ezan' name. There are also other vases in the catalogue which are not shown in Decelle too and are either later designs or moulds acquired from elsewhere. I am not aware of Sabino ever having produced Jobling patterns, and it's generally believed that the Jobling moulds went to other UK makers -- certainly we have evidence of the small Bird & Panel vase mould ending up at Sowerby, while Davidson also reissued Jobling's jazzy cigarette holder base/ ashtray in the sixties.

[chopin-liszt]

Thank-you for all that lovely extra info. Steven. 

[NevB]

Yes thankyou Steven, the information was useful to all of us. I had already come to the conclusion, rather belatedly, that the mark was meant to deceive.

[chopin-liszt]

And of real interest that the deceptive mark was so good.
It is very, very like the mark made on contemporary Sabino pressings.

But done by somebody who was not quite clever enough for it to be consistent with Sabino work or the correct dates.