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Author Topic: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please  (Read 5376 times)

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Offline English weather

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2022, 01:35:40 AM »
Quote
but even I know that my 'opinion' or experience for what it's worth, is not what is required to correctly identify a glass maker. 

Your experience is enough to give a considered opinion on the current acceptance of who made a particular type of glass. As Cyril Manley proves, new information can replace accepted convention and that is no bad thing.

To constantly use a negative opinion without alternative proof or good cause is not conducive to finding an identification of a glass object.

If I needed to, I can find plenty of Bonhams, Sotheby's, Christies references to Clichy glass though of course, some may in fact be St.Louis or Baccarat.
Attribution is / was based on current understanding unless of course they reference an original source. With antique glass it can sometimes be a case of collecting in a class of types such as Wrythen Striped vases by Clichy, St. Louis, Baccarat. Salviati of the 19th century is another example. but let us not complicate the matter.






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Offline flying free

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2022, 08:39:48 AM »
- I can only speak for myself - part of my reason for wanting to ensure items are identified correctly is the fact that some items are sold and therefore purchased at much higher cost than their real value, precisely because they have been mis-identified. 

In some cases deliberately mis-identified. In others, well, of course, there is always caveat emptor but that's difficult for any new collector especially with glass which is for the most part unsigned, especially antique and much vintage glass. 

In any area of the arts, the name of the maker can skew the price quite dramatically depending on desirability and availability at the time.  With glass, much unsigned, it becomes important the buyer knows what they are buying.

In years gone by there was not the wealth of information available at the fingertips so  items were identified  on whatever knowledge was available from books, word of mouth etc. 




- Fortunately time has moved on - much information is now available on the internet and at fingertips and the museums particularly have made great strides in terms of making their collections available to view online.  There is also a wealth of information to explore out there in other languages. 

In my opinion it's important to  attribute and say it is 'possibly by' and give the reasons for that thought process, rather than deliberately identify an item as from a particular maker when there is no real proof of the authenticity. 
It stops the  situation of people paying huge amounts of money for something that  may not warrant the price. 




- Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and so people will always pay more for something they desire for whatever reason regardless of the maker.  However it's important they know the market value of that item and aren't misled into thinking they own a priceless antique/collectable.





- The other part of my reason for wanting the glass I own to be correctly identified is, that for me, researching a maker or glass house is a huge part of the fun and interest of acquiring knowledge about glass making.  I love glass and often I love researching it as much as or more than the actual piece :)

m






P.S. 
And in the case of this particular piece, the canes decor appears to be shown in the Clichy book but it's difficult to be really sure they are exactly the same :
1) I think there could be differences (clear glass stripes that I can't see on the Clichy decor) and
2) The Clichy book has a descriptor of 'attributed to' under this particular piece that has similar canes decor and
3) The shape is very 'Clichy' like to my eye but there is not an exact match to the shape in the book, or not that I could see and
4) Ekimp has raised the issue of a piece with similar(same?) cane decor being in the From Neuwelt to the Whole World book (same piece and detailed description appears on Das Bohmische Glas Band II ) and that piece being identified as Neuwelt by Dr Jarmila Bro˛ovį

So, enough queries to mean it needs to be further discussed before attribution or identification.

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Offline Ekimp

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #32 on: January 19, 2022, 09:46:38 AM »
There is one here https://antikes-glas.de/en/neuwelt/bottle-colorless-glass-with-thread-decoration-josephinenhuette-neuwelt-p-2504.html?language=en that looks to me to be the same decor as the op’s and the one in the Harrach book but a different colour. Attributed to either Neuwelt or Josephinenhütte with references.
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Offline Yxeli

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2022, 09:57:25 AM »
Hey guys, couldnt get the image quality right with the 125 kb maximum, so I uploaded them elsewhere, Here are the links:

https://ibb.co/JzFqyTn
https://ibb.co/Ntxdckj
https://ibb.co/NYWLfwr
https://ibb.co/VMZQ6Ym

If you need more let me know!

Thanks all!

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Offline Ekimp

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People say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day - Winnie-the-Pooh

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Offline Yxeli

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #35 on: January 20, 2022, 10:01:38 AM »
Thanks so much for your help Ekimp!

I think the colours match very much to my piece....I reckon you could be spot on ! :)

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Offline flying free

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #36 on: January 20, 2022, 10:15:08 AM »
The shape isn't particularly Bohemian though.
The canes may be the same/very similar but it is possible they could also be found on Clichy glass as well.  There are two jugs mounted in metal rims and bases in a similar shape to your vase in the Clichy book - with the same/similar cane decor.  They are in the Musee Historique et Archeologique de Clichy and are identified as Clichy.
There is also a pink and white decanter in a similar cane decor.  To my eye though the canes appear thinner than those on this decanter with the white being slightly wider than the pink in the Clichy decanter:
https://antikes-glas.de/en/neuwelt/bottle-colorless-glass-with-thread-decoration-josephinenhuette-neuwelt-p-2504.html?language=en

There is also a pink and white striped bowl on the opposite page in the Clichy book page 300 - and the pink and white with clear edge canes on that look to be the same width pink and white.


Can you look at the base of the vase and see whether it looks as though it has been polished smooth almost right to the edge of the vase.

English Weather appears to have a similar (the same?) piece and seems to be saying that the piece would be polished right to the edge of the base nearly.

Is yours like this?  and is the rim of your vase cut and polished flat or is it rounded?

That pontil finish polished to the edge of the base is something seen on French glass - but not seen on Bohemian glass.

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Offline Yxeli

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #37 on: January 20, 2022, 10:44:29 AM »
Thank you Flying Free :)

The base seems to be the same texture (very smooth and shiny, so polished?) right to the very edge, and then the very edges of the base have some small chips, so not polished there?

The rim doesnt seem to be cut and polished at all, just rounded as you say.

:) Thank you so much for your expertise and time!

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Offline Yxeli

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #38 on: January 20, 2022, 10:53:42 AM »
Heres a picture of the rim if that helps?

https://ibb.co/8bw6YPN

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Offline NevB

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Re: Striped Blown Glass Vase Identification needed Please
« Reply #39 on: January 20, 2022, 02:29:30 PM »
Yxeli, I'd go with Clichy if only for the fact your vase is a miniature one, as you say, only 4.5"/11.5cm. Either way you're on to a winner.
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