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1
British & Irish Glass / Re: Walsh Glass works.
« Last post by keith on Today at 12:11:13 AM »
Thanks M, I'll look at that when I'm more awake  :)
2
British & Irish Glass / Re: Walsh Glass works.
« Last post by flying free on Yesterday at 10:10:42 AM »
No help with photos but didn't know where to put this info.

Came across a snippet  that in 1866 Mrs Walsh Walsh 'carried on' the Vesta Works in Birmingham, Vesta Works built by a son of Shakespear (of Johnston and Shakespear) :

https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/The_Victoria_History_of_the_County_of_Wa/Qp44AQAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=johnson,+berry+and+harris+glass+works&dq=johnson,+berry+and+harris+glass+works&printsec=frontcover

3
Glass / Re: Topaz or Canary or Victoria
« Last post by flying free on February 12, 2025, 06:02:24 PM »
(Thank you, I didn't know it was called a  cross pattée)

RE the cross pattée crown perfume bottles and link to Harrach

Here is another possible link to Harrach in conjunction with the design links to the two crown items that are shown in the Harrach book - one a crown perfume bottle and the other a crown lid for a pokal:

Wikipedia says (amongst other descriptions of the cross pattée - this is just the one that was most relevant to this discussion)
'Iron Cross
In 1813, King Frederick William III of Prussia established the Iron Cross as a decoration for military valor, and it remained in use, in various forms, by Prussia and later Germany until 1945.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_patt%C3%A9e

Wikipedia says this of the link between King Frederick William III of Prussia and the House of Harrach:
'In 1824 Frederick William III married for the second time, to Countess Auguste von Harrach zu Rohrau und Thannhausen. At the time of their marriage, the House of Harrach was still not recognized as equal to other European royal families for dynastic purposes. The marriage was therefore morganatic and she was created Princess of Liegnitz. They had no children.[4]'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_William_III_of_Prussia



Harrach did use a stain - there is a candlestick in the book From Neuwelt to the Whole World - plate116 'colourless glass, partially stained yellow and engraved' and 'c.1835' and ' Museum of Decorative Arts, Prague inv. no. 17953'
Yellow and red staining very famous in Bohemian glass (see Friedrich Egermann)



So ... we know Harrach made stained yellow glass, we also know they made crown perfume flakons with cross stoppers and lids for goblets in the crown design with a cross for a stopper.  We know there is a link between the House of Harrach and King Frederick William III of Prussia.


The bottom part of every crown perfume bottle, with the exception of the Adelaide stained bottle which has other similarities, is very similar in design device and cutting to the becher on page 135 of From Neuwelt to the Whole World - plate 153 engraving by Dominik Biemann 1828.



I cannot currently find a link between Queen Adelaide and King Frederick William III or his second wife Countess Auguste von Harrach.
Queen Adelaide was from Saxe-Meiningen.  Her father and details here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_I,_Duke_of_Saxe-Meiningen

However, Queen Victoria's eldest child, her daughter Princess Victoria, was married to the German Emperor Frederick III at 17 (so 1857?) and  became Queen of Prussia. She was named after Queen Adelaide (Adelaide married King William but had no surviving children so King William's niece became Queen Victoria):
'Victoria, Princess Royal (Victoria Adelaide Mary Louisa;[1] 21 November 1840 – 5 August 1901) was German Empress and Queen of Prussia as the wife of Frederick III, German Emperor. '
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria,_Princess_Royal

So the crown perfume bottle could have made it's way over here via a later date and as a present from the Queen of Prussia.



Re Apsley Pellatt and Falcon Glass Works query over whether they made crown pierced cut perfume bottles with cross stoppers

Currently I don't have any evidence for this.  Does anyone know if there is a crown perfume bottle anywhere with a patent on it or with definitive id from Apsley Pellatt?
4
Glass / Re: Topaz or Canary or Victoria
« Last post by cagney on February 11, 2025, 10:19:51 PM »
 Most likely you are correct on Poulenc Wittman. I read it as Pauline Whitman, but somewhat difficult to read their writing.
  The Priory Crown I think a good chance probably German. Silver nitrate stain very much in their tradition. Possibly a gift to commemorate her ascendence. From her aristocratic family back home? A bit different than the others structurally. The base rises up into the arches a little and is cut and decorated. The engraving well thought out, as the engraver leaves some stain to highlight the stem vein in the leaf and the pricklies on the round part of the thistles. The Cross Patee seems to be a popular motive for crowns in general [Wikipedia]. This particular version unknown.

  Siver nitrate stain used in this country on some lacy bowsl/plates to highlight certain design features around 1840s and much later as well. English usage I really do not know.
5
Glass / Re: Topaz or Canary or Victoria
« Last post by flying free on February 10, 2025, 05:28:15 PM »
There is a more detailed story possibly here on Wiki.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poulenc_Fr%C3%A8res
re Wittman Poulenc

So it may have been the 1850s perhaps according to the names involved in the business as Poulenc (son in law of Wittman, married Wittman's daughter) took over the business completely in 1858.  No info on them selling uranium products at that time however Poulenc was a chemist and it reads as though they were distributing photographs supplies.  Uranium oxides might have been involved in that.


page 166 here Great Exhibition 1851 - Johnson Matthey showing lots of stuff including Uranium Oxide ... and apparently exhibiting a glass vessel made of uranium glass (bit like the glass vessel of uranium glass apparently on display on the Powell stand?  - wonder if they all had an example of the recent imports of uranium glass vessels from Germany?):
https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/Official_Descriptive_and_Illustrated_Cat/fb1AAAAAcAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=johnson+matthey+great+exhibition+uranium+oxide&pg=RA1-PA166&printsec=frontcover
6
Glass / Re: Info on James Powell Topaz glass - "The Queen Victoria Topaz bowl"
« Last post by flying free on February 10, 2025, 01:47:17 AM »
  This ia the first description of the refinement/reduction of uranium ore I have seen. I find it most interesting that they reduce it and make sure there is no lead left in it then add a certain amount of lead/flint and cook it to get the powdered form to add to the glass batch. Gillinder in his treatise gives some descriptions of refining/reducing particular ingredients, but not uranium. I think by the 1850s it could be had already refined to a large degree. The sourcing most important as to quality of the refined ore [Whitman/Paris better than the English].

 ...

Cagney I think looking at the photograph you posted on the Topaz thread of the recipe it's Poulenc Wittman and see information I've posted in the one above this.
7
Glass / Re: Info on James Powell Topaz glass - "The Queen Victoria Topaz bowl"
« Last post by flying free on February 10, 2025, 01:37:50 AM »

Just adding what I put on the Topaz thread here for completion.  In answer to your question about Paris Whittman I think the company was Poulenc Wittman and this is the history (see below):


 I think Poulenc Wittman is this - this company seems to have started in 1852.  However it seems the distribution of fine chemicals bit came about from 1878?:
https://stichtinghistorischemicroscopie.nl/en/category/poulenc-freres-en/
'Léon Wittman and his brother in law, Etienne Poulenc (1823-1878),  began by retailing photographic products under the “P.W.” name around 1852 and then manufacturing them round the end of the decade. After Etienne’s death in 1878, his widow ran the company with her sons for a couple of years, and then the 2 brothers, Gaston and Emile took over under the name Poulenc Frères. They focused on the production and distribution of fine chemicals, photographic products and colours for glass and ceramics. Meanwhile, the youngest brother, Camille, qualified as a pharmacist and then fires and up to silence in 1893. After he joined the company, they added a research laboratory and a scientific library.

In 1900, the firm became a public limited company. In 1903, they opened a new establishment in Paris dedicated to photographic products and including a projection room in the basement. They continued making pharmaceuticals and other chemicals including, also in 1903, the synthetic anaesthetic stovaine which was used on the large-scale until 1940. In 1928, Rhône-Poulenc, a conglomerate of small chemical and pharmaceutical companies, was formed.'
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8
Glass / Re: Topaz or Canary or Victoria
« Last post by flying free on February 10, 2025, 01:33:35 AM »
  ...

   I leave you with this tidbit from Deming Jarves agent [spy?] in Europe from a letter sent probably 1850 s

https://www.glassmessages.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=73090.0;attach=262532;image


Cagney I think Poulenc Wittman is this - this company seems to have started in 1852.  However it seems the distribution of fine chemicals bit for glass came about from 1878/1880?  So you might be able to date that recipe requesting buy from Wittman to c.1878 ish?:

https://stichtinghistorischemicroscopie.nl/en/category/poulenc-freres-en/
'Léon Wittman and his brother in law, Etienne Poulenc (1823-1878),  began by retailing photographic products under the “P.W.” name around 1852 and then manufacturing them round the end of the decade. After Etienne’s death in 1878, his widow ran the company with her sons for a couple of years, and then the 2 brothers, Gaston and Emile took over under the name Poulenc Frères. They focused on the production and distribution of fine chemicals, photographic products and colours for glass and ceramics. Meanwhile, the youngest brother, Camille, qualified as a pharmacist and then fires and up to silence in 1893. After he joined the company, they added a research laboratory and a scientific library.

In 1900, the firm became a public limited company. In 1903, they opened a new establishment in Paris dedicated to photographic products and including a projection room in the basement. They continued making pharmaceuticals and other chemicals including, also in 1903, the synthetic anaesthetic stovaine which was used on the large-scale until 1940. In 1928, Rhône-Poulenc, a conglomerate of small chemical and pharmaceutical companies, was formed.'
9
Glass / Re: EAPG Identification Help Please
« Last post by tonyatl on February 10, 2025, 12:37:51 AM »
this article has the goods:
https://www.ndga.net/articles/wallsoleander.php

apparently it is willow pattern by indiana glass company which introduced it in the 1930s and was still made as late as 1960s. it may also be the oleander pattern. so it is not eapg, but modern glass.
10
Glass / EAPG Identification Help Please
« Last post by tonyatl on February 10, 2025, 12:23:46 AM »
I have what i believe is early american pattern glass. i normally don't buy this kind of glass but the price seemed too low so i bought it. it is simply decorated with leafy branches, has a spherical stem, and squarish foot. it also has a few air bubbles so i started to doubt 1920s/30s as its age. however, it does resemble some cut glass patterns of the time.

any idea on age, maker, pattern?
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